Pretentious Snobby Bastard Fly Fishing!!!!

General: Fly Fishing BS => The bar is open.... => Topic started by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on October 10, 2014, 12:46:22 PM

Title: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on October 10, 2014, 12:46:22 PM
This is an interesting notion I had not considered.  Also included are some thought-provoking tidbits on our American history – true or not, but darned curious. 

http://www.cnn.com/2014/10/10/us/guns-race/index.html?hpt=hp_c2 (http://www.cnn.com/2014/10/10/us/guns-race/index.html?hpt=hp_c2)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on October 10, 2014, 13:10:02 PM
Saw a black guy open carrying a Glock the other day and didn't think twice about it.  Funniest thing, a couple years ago I saw a biker with a 1911 inside his waistband with no holster, cocked and locked.  I felt pretty unsafe for him.

I bought a .22 lever action this week, when we going squirrel hunting?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on October 10, 2014, 13:21:37 PM
Quote from: Big J on October 10, 2014, 13:10:02 PM
I bought a .22 lever action this week, when we going squirrel hunting?

A Henry? A Marlin? 

I really like lever actions.  My favorite rifle is my old Savage 99 in .250-3000.

We will go squirrel hunting when you tell me you will eat your kill.  It should be an interesting year for squirrels --- lots of acorns where I hunt.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: sanjuanwormhatch on October 10, 2014, 13:31:56 PM
QuoteThese racial fears may seem like they belong to another era, but sometimes the present looks like the past, one historian says.

There was a run on gun stores when President Obama was elected and another when he was re-elected. There was also a run on gun stores just before President Clinton signed the Federal Assault Weapons ban in 1994. One historian, however, says the surges in gun sales that accompanied Obama's elections were reminiscent of another era.

Or, rather than racism, maybe the obama gun rush was instigated by the fear of gun control laws, not that the person just elected was black (or whatever the hail he is).  It is especially ironic that after trying to make the point, the author points out an example of where gun control instigated a gun rush.

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on October 10, 2014, 13:33:33 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood on October 10, 2014, 13:21:37 PM
Quote from: Big J on October 10, 2014, 13:10:02 PM
I bought a .22 lever action this week, when we going squirrel hunting?

A Henry? A Marlin? 

I really like lever actions.  My favorite rifle is my old Savage 99 in .250-3000.

We will go squirrel hunting when you tell me you will eat your kill.  It should be an interesting year for squirrels --- lots of acorns where I hunt.

A Henry.  I would eat the squirrel.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: bullship on October 10, 2014, 14:00:54 PM
I miss my Henry. Hope to have another someday
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on October 10, 2014, 14:04:06 PM
Mudwall, looked up the Savage 99.  Neat design it being a hammerless lever action gun.

http://www.chuckhawks.com/savage_99.htm (http://www.chuckhawks.com/savage_99.htm)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Grannyknot on October 10, 2014, 14:19:38 PM
Quote from: Big J on October 10, 2014, 13:10:02 PM
Saw a black guy open carrying a Glock the other day and didn't think twice about it. 

That was just the new sheriff.

http://youtu.be/upvZdVK913I (http://youtu.be/upvZdVK913I)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on October 10, 2014, 14:20:18 PM
Quote from: Big J on October 10, 2014, 14:04:06 PM
Mudwall, looked up the Savage 99.  Neat design it being a hammerless lever action gun.

.....and a rotary magazine, which I like.  It is a classic firearm as far as I am concerned.  I always wanted one, since I was a teen.  A young kid that lived upstream of me on Back Creek had one, and I always admired it.  I finally found one in a gun shop.  It was made in 1956, the year that I was born, and is excellent shape.  I was lucky on the caliber, because I knew nothing about the .250-3000 before I purchased the rifle.  The .250 is a wonderful cartridge.  The rifle has a Lyman Tang sight and I can shoot it OK even with my failing vision.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.250-3000_Savage (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.250-3000_Savage)

I'd like to have a Henry.  I have enough .22, but I would like to have one of their lever actions in 44 mag.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on October 10, 2014, 14:36:10 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood on October 10, 2014, 14:20:18 PM
Quote from: Big J on October 10, 2014, 14:04:06 PM
Mudwall, looked up the Savage 99.  Neat design it being a hammerless lever action gun.

.....and a rotary magazine, which I like.  It is a classic firearm as far as I am concerned.  I always wanted one, since I was a teen.  A young kid that lived upstream of me on Back Creek had one, and I always admired it.  I finally found one in a gun shop.  It was made in 1956, the year that I was born, and is excellent shape.  I was lucky on the caliber, because I knew nothing about the .250-3000 before I purchased the rifle.  The .250 is a wonderful cartridge.  The rifle has a Lyman Tang sight and I can shoot it OK even with my failing vision.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.250-3000_Savage (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.250-3000_Savage)

I'd like to have a Henry.  I have enough .22, but I would like to have one of their lever actions in 44 mag.

Guy I bought the .22 Henry from also had a .44 Henry.  I think he said he was going to give it to his brother in law though.  I won't shoot the .44 lever action enough to justify buying one. 

How hard is it to find the .250-3000 savage?  I figure it is a difficult round to find.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: flatlander on October 10, 2014, 15:33:29 PM
Quote from: sanjuanwormhatch on October 10, 2014, 13:31:56 PM
There was a run on gun stores when President Obama was elected and another when he was re-elected. There was also a run on gun stores just before President Clinton signed the Federal Assault Weapons ban in 1994. One historian, however, says the surges in gun sales that accompanied Obama's elections were reminiscent of another era.


This.

After the shooting in Connecticut, I marched down to the Sheriff's office and got 3 pistol permits.  I thought there was a good chance Obama was going to ram gun legislation through Congress, and if I wanted a pistol then I better go ahead and get it.   I was surprised that I could obtain the permits the same day I applied for them.  I thought there was waiting period...apparently not, because within 30 minutes I walked out of the Sheriff's office with the permits.  I went straight to Gander Mountain and bought a .40 S&W.  I can't hit the side of a barn with it.  It's locked in a gun cabinet  behind a dead-bolted closet door. 

I will probably buy an AR-15, too...before the race riots happen :P
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on October 10, 2014, 15:54:05 PM
Dad bought an old (pre-64) winchester 30/30 last year. Beautiful little feller
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: tomato can on October 10, 2014, 19:38:09 PM
Big Mud I have a .300 savage lever with the brass round counter. 
Title: For the love of guns
Post by: benben reincarnated on October 10, 2014, 19:47:31 PM
I gots an 1898 Winchester lever action .32-20.  Octagon barrel.  Fun as hell to shoot.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on October 11, 2014, 10:31:16 AM
I wanted a Winchester 9422 or Winchester 94 in .357 originally.  But when I saw the Henry .22 for the price it was at, I couldn't pass. 

That Winchester 1898 is a heck of a collectors piece if it's in good shape.  Don't see many of that model around anymore.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: tomato can on October 11, 2014, 13:15:58 PM
I also have a high wall browning single shot in 30 06 and a Pennsylvania trombone chambered in 30 06.  Always coveted a .44 mag lever action but never pulled the trigger.   (pun intended)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: benben reincarnated on October 11, 2014, 15:49:07 PM

Quote from: Big J on October 11, 2014, 10:31:16 AM
I wanted a Winchester 9422 or Winchester 94 in .357 originally.  But when I saw the Henry .22 for the price it was at, I couldn't pass. 

That Winchester 1898 is a heck of a collectors piece if it's in good shape.  Don't see many of that model around anymore.

It's in pretty decent shape.  Been in the family. 

I also have an 1873 US Springfield trap door chambered in .45-70.  It is a beast of a gun.  I love it more than the Winchester 1898. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on October 12, 2014, 09:10:58 AM
The guns some of you own --- darned interesting --- thanks for sharing. 

I have a few firearms that I will keep and pass down --the Savage for sure, the Winchester 94 that my dad bought in 1947 for $57 from Richardson Hardware in Marlinton WV (the first gun he owned – borrowed firearms before), and the prized .22 Stevens falling block single shot that my granddad gave me.  The story on the Stevens .22 is a fascinating one.  My granddad ran a general store, starting in 1923.  Bubblegum came in huge wooden boxes, and then placed in glass jars for by-piece sale.  Often in the wooden boxes there would be a prize.  The Stevens was a prize in one of the bubblegum boxes.  My granddad also had a small farm and used the .22 for many years for farm chores.  I remember the rifle being used for killing the pigs at butchering time.  He was kind enough to award me the firearm before he died.  I killed my first squirrel with the Stevens. 

I have no worries about any sort of gun control.  I enjoy those firearms I own, but I'd be more combative if those "jackbooted government thugs" came for my fishing poles.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: tomato can on October 12, 2014, 11:45:58 AM
I have a 12 gauge double barrel my Grandpa got for delivering a baby.  I think its a stevens but I would have to check in the gun safe.  But then again he delivered over 12K babies in his career.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on October 12, 2014, 13:08:51 PM
Quote from: tomato can on October 12, 2014, 11:45:58 AM
I have a 12 gauge double barrel my Grandpa got for delivering a baby.  I think its a stevens but I would have to check in the gun safe.  But then again he delivered over 12K babies in his career.

Great stuff, TC!  I enjoy this kind of info.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: tomato can on October 12, 2014, 18:44:51 PM
TF, My grandfathers practice was in Greenville, PA.  He was also a surgeon in WWII worked on Marines in an over run Japanese Bunker on Guadalcanal etc but would never talk about his WWII service just shake his head slowly. But he did a lot.  I of course only have stories of tomfoolery....   
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: tomato can on October 12, 2014, 19:36:47 PM
Them dang frozen chosin jar heads.  Amazing story.  I've read a couple of books on that specific part of the war and the overall Korean war.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: creekfreak on October 14, 2014, 11:11:34 AM
My daddy had 43 firearms in the house growing up and I belonged to the NRA... wow how times have changed for me... but I do say that the Mudman should invite us all up to Bath Co. for a hunt. I'll borrow a .22 and we'll all have a Bath Co. 7 course meal. Squirrel and a 6 pack!
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Transylwader on October 14, 2014, 18:39:51 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on October 14, 2014, 18:36:49 PM
i have more guns than i know what to do with and i am proud life member of the nra. id be happy to go and visit mudd and bring my .223
Nice shirt bru.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: benben reincarnated on October 14, 2014, 21:12:10 PM
I like a good fight. 

You boys be safe this weekend and catch lots of trouts.  Keep the guns away from Tranny though. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: benben reincarnated on October 15, 2014, 20:07:58 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on October 15, 2014, 05:37:54 AM
i trust him with a gun before id even remotely consider handing one over to  some of the gentry around here

True.   But don't give Tranny tha guns.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dougfish on October 15, 2014, 20:10:55 PM
If he pulls the trigger like he strip sets....................
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Transylwader on October 15, 2014, 20:13:44 PM
Quote from: Dougfish on October 15, 2014, 20:10:55 PM
If he pulls the trigger like he strip sets....................
no trout setters. Fuck em like you mean it -+;
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: benben reincarnated on October 15, 2014, 20:14:09 PM
If I had a dollar for every time I've seen Mike "air fly fish" in a bar I'd be rich.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Transylwader on October 15, 2014, 22:17:16 PM
Shit got real...can we clean up Ashe Co properly? Can we? Can we?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Transylwader on October 15, 2014, 22:38:44 PM
No my good man, I was talking along the lines of flamethrowers, R4 assaultage and THEN rounding up the survivors and hanging them in the West Jefferson town square. As God is my witness, we need to clear before we engage in the real enemy...WAKE CO.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Transylwader on October 16, 2014, 12:16:24 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on October 16, 2014, 11:52:22 AM
I am also authorizing relaxed grooming standards for this op
I got a haircut yesterday. I don't need "black like me" hair products to contain my nappy ass hay-uh
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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Transylwader on October 16, 2014, 12:31:49 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on October 16, 2014, 12:18:13 PM
I see you've has printer working overtime creating your I love me wall
Nope, that comes with getting an ejumecation, whilst daddy was shooting up bad people, paying for babu, I was getting my mind set on organising the infrastructure of storm water shit in Murica. That be some funked up shit raat thar...
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: tomato can on October 17, 2014, 05:23:41 AM
Quote from: Transylwader on October 16, 2014, 12:16:24 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on October 16, 2014, 11:52:22 AM
I am also authorizing relaxed grooming standards for this op
I got a haircut yesterday. I don't need "black like me" hair products to contain my nappy ass hay-uh
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Tranny where is your chin?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on October 17, 2014, 21:51:54 PM
It was fun meeting steelrain, tranny, and troutfanatic at the Woodlands tonight.

Back to the gun topic -- I have a Springfield 1864 58 caliber rifle my great grandfather used in the Civil War. It is still in working condition (I have never tried to fire it), and has his initials carved into the stock. It even still has the original sling.

I'll try to take a pic tomorrow, but it looks like this --

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Woolly Bugger on October 17, 2014, 22:13:48 PM

Quote from: steelrain202 on October 17, 2014, 22:07:28 PM
Phil is a bad ass. He can play the fuck outta some guitar

Rock on
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Transylwader on October 18, 2014, 07:33:11 AM
Mr. Stinson, your Music, sir, it's tits up ballistic mate. Great to finally meet you. /'/
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on October 18, 2014, 14:44:21 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on October 18, 2014, 08:30:04 AM
Phil plays the piano like Elton John. However I don't know if he plays the flute.

I don't play no Elton John on the piano, or the flute neither. You're just trying to fuck with me, Steelrain. I got yer number now.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on October 18, 2014, 20:35:12 PM
Yes. I can play the shit out of any piano and play the shit out of a guitar. Unfortunately, I'm not such a good flyfisherman anymore. I cannot wade without busting my ass.  :o
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: DRIFTS on October 19, 2014, 08:57:12 AM
Phil can beat the hell outta a banjo too...I'm like, "fuuuck" after see'n that  bd;0 /'/ V:;
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on October 20, 2014, 16:13:23 PM
I also have a Springfield Armory model 1898 Krag. Basically spotless. A big heavy rifle.
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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on October 20, 2014, 16:19:46 PM
My grandfather used it in the Spanish-American War.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Aka on October 20, 2014, 20:02:57 PM
Got this for my daughter today.











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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on October 21, 2014, 20:27:01 PM
My first gun was an Ivers Johnson single shot  20 gauge when I was 10 years old. Great gun. It was my father's first gun. I gave it to my son recently. He took it completely apart and replaced all working parts, and now shoots it. I'm proud of him for doing that.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: sanjuanwormhatch on October 22, 2014, 08:21:00 AM
Very much a fan of shotguns give or take a few varieties.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: bmadd on October 22, 2014, 09:06:58 AM
Shotguns are what I favor as well. A few at home include a Remington Model 11, Winchester Model 12, an old Ithaca sxs that I can't make out any details on, and a Browning Belguim made Double Automatic.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: benben reincarnated on October 22, 2014, 09:27:51 AM
I have a 12 gauge Franchi O/U that my grandfather got as a retirement present, great gun, kicks well.  I do love my Remington Model 1100 for spraying mass amounts of lead into the air though.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on October 22, 2014, 09:55:14 AM
I own one good shotgun, and several pieces of shotgun junk.  I bought a Ruger Red Label (fixed chokes =improved and modified) 20 gauge for birds about 25 years ago.  I've not had it out in years; it is a good dove getter. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: sanjuanwormhatch on October 22, 2014, 11:14:49 AM
Hell, I'd buy that gun from you Mudwall if you ever want to depart with it.

Edit: probably a little early to start political debate out of respect for those injured/killed.  We'll talk later.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on October 22, 2014, 11:21:48 AM
Quote from: sanjuanwormhatch on October 22, 2014, 11:14:49 AM
Hell, I'd buy that gun from you Mudwall if you ever want to depart with it.

Public shooting in Canada.  Aren't they looked at as the shining example of gun control = less violence?  Have they ever had something like this?  Will be curious to see what happens.

I'll be interested too.  There are mixed reports that the Solider that was shot is alive and dead.  Either way, tragic attack.

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: ruttness on October 22, 2014, 22:10:40 PM
Quote from: troutfanatic on October 22, 2014, 20:11:31 PM
So was the real threat the gun or the individual or his half-assed religion of hate?

i like to point threat in gun violence to shitty parenting and their demoralization of the value of a human life. 10 year olds should not watch or play games depicting the battle on the front lines without first understanding a firearm its rules and the responsibility  of owning an object that can do severe destruction

just my .02
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on October 23, 2014, 07:38:11 AM
Quote from: ruttness on October 22, 2014, 22:10:40 PM
Quote from: troutfanatic on October 22, 2014, 20:11:31 PM
So was the real threat the gun or the individual or his half-assed religion of hate?

i like to point threat in gun violence to shitty parenting and their demoralization of the value of a human life. 10 year olds should not watch or play games depicting the battle on the front lines without first understanding a firearm its rules and the responsibility  of owning an object that can do severe destruction

just my .02

Hey Red, I believe you are smoking your socks. 

I will agree with you that parenting in many cases should be better, but is this anything new in our (U.S.) brief history? 

Also, I don't think you can demoralize a value, can you?

Just my nickel.     2 cents gets you nothing these days. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: ruttness on October 24, 2014, 01:29:11 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood on October 23, 2014, 07:38:11 AM
Quote from: ruttness on October 22, 2014, 22:10:40 PM
Quote from: troutfanatic on October 22, 2014, 20:11:31 PM
So was the real threat the gun or the individual or his half-assed religion of hate?

i like to point threat in gun violence to shitty parenting and their demoralization of the value of a human life. 10 year olds should not watch or play games depicting the battle on the front lines without first understanding a firearm its rules and the responsibility  of owning an object that can do severe destruction

just my .02

Hey Red, I believe you are smoking your socks. 

I will agree with you that parenting in many cases should be better, but is this anything new in our (U.S.) brief history? 

Also, I don't think you can demoralize a value, can you?

Just my nickel.     2 cents gets you nothing these days.

this debate could go on for days. but ill toss in a dime to say that before doom kids didnt shoot up schools. yes doom. a shitty game about shooting demons. fast forward to now. call of duty, battlefield name it. game depicting realistic death are endless. with weapons that can and are store bought. theres a maturity rating for a reason. the rich parents that like to throw money at their kids instead of any sort of affection are lessening the value of a life while alienating a child for for necessary  upbringing. hell arisoft is a horrible idea when it come to civilian recreation, lets mimc looks weight and feel of a real gun to break every one of the gun rules that should be but weren't taught to the user 

again it just my opinion but back in the day if some one shot another person they knew damn well what the were doing and would rather catch a shiv in the courtyard than plead insanity for taking innocent lives
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: benben reincarnated on October 24, 2014, 06:41:25 AM
FYI, gun violence has decreased over the past 20 years.  Fun with numbers...

http://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/fv9311.pdf (http://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/fv9311.pdf)

The media chooses what to report, thus bringing attention to gun related violence.  More firearm deaths were occurring in the past, we just didn't have the 24/7 news cycle that feeds on ad revenue. 



This data is a little old as well, but the volume of deaths by firearms is still pretty fucking astronomical here in the U.S.

http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/injury.htm (http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/injury.htm)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: The Dude on October 24, 2014, 07:35:27 AM
Superimpose the crack epidemic over those numbers and I think you'll see that there is a correlation. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: flatlander on October 24, 2014, 07:47:27 AM
...and strip out the black-on-black murders committed from those statistics, and I bet we're in line with other countries.  That's the 800 lb gorilla nobody wants to discuss.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on October 24, 2014, 07:54:38 AM
Quote from: ruttness on October 24, 2014, 01:29:11 AM
this debate could go on for days. .......... arisoft is a horrible idea when it come to civilian recreation, lets mimc looks weight and feel of a real gun to break every one of the gun rules that should be but weren't taught to the user 

You are correct about one thing. This debate will continue.

I don't blame guns, or video games, or parents (rich or poor), and I certainly don't blame Airsoft.  Heck fire we had battles with BB guns that looked real when I was a kid.  It was surely unwise, but luckily no one lost an eye and not one of those stupid boys has killed anyone.

Don't misunderstand, I am sure I could find someone or something to blame, if I thought about it long enough. 

I thought I saw your handle on another forum; you need to buck-up and join the NRA, if you have not already.

Peace.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on October 24, 2014, 08:05:38 AM
Quote from: Flatlander on October 24, 2014, 07:47:27 AM
...and strip out the black-on-black murders committed from those statistics, and I bet we're in line with other countries.  That's the 800 lb gorilla nobody wants to discuss.

Why strip out "black-on-black" from the U.S. data?  Are these folks not U.S. citizens?  Not part of the U.S.A.?  That is like deleting the entire state of SC to make those U.S. math and science test scores look better when compared to the rest of the developed world.  Ohhh....., there I go again, poking the great state of SC.  Sorry Dude and other dudes.

Flats, you amaze me sometimes!!  I still love you man!
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: benben reincarnated on October 24, 2014, 10:14:23 AM
While on the NRA, this commercial popped up on TV the other night, I was watching ABC at the time:

Secret Police (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52alOfSwR4E#ws)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: ruttness on October 24, 2014, 10:38:02 AM

Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood on October 24, 2014, 07:54:38 AM


I thought I saw your handle on another forum; you need to buck-up and join the NRA, if you have not already.

Peace.

You'll find my handle on multiple firearms fourms, I've been a lifetime member of the NRA for almost 10 years now. I still have a couple of unbuilt lowers that were gifts for the Harrisburg dinner a few years back
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: sanjuanwormhatch on October 24, 2014, 10:58:02 AM
Jason Carter (Grandson of Jimmy Carter), who is running for Gov. in GA as a democrat, voted yes on the recent comprehensive pro gun legislation. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: sanjuanwormhatch on October 24, 2014, 12:02:14 PM
I would hardly say looking at mass shooting incidents "distorts" the facts.  They are the facts.  They alone, even without black on black crime, at least merit a discussion on gun control to see if it can prevent said incidents.  In other words, if you want to distinguish mass shootings and black on black crime, fine, but both, separately, are major problems and deserve a hard looking at. 

Once you establish that, it becomes relevant to compare the lack of mass shootings in gun control countries with our incidents which is frequently how media/anti gunners phrases the argument which I'm assuming is what you mean when you say "he anti-gunners like to use incidents like Newtown and Columbine to distort the actual nature of the gun violence problem in the United States."
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: sanjuanwormhatch on October 24, 2014, 12:15:57 PM
So your stance is that mass shootings happen and we should do nothing to try to prevent them?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: benben reincarnated on October 24, 2014, 12:31:19 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on October 24, 2014, 12:21:17 PM
But if we can impede the rights of millions to save just one, it's justified right?

Correct.


Hello Patriot Act.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: flatlander on October 24, 2014, 12:34:06 PM
Quote from: sanjuanwormhatch on October 24, 2014, 12:15:57 PM
So your stance is that mass shootings happen and we should do nothing to try to prevent them?

1.  Be careful what you read in Mother Jones regarding the supposed increase in mass shootings.  Kevin Drum gets a lot of that wrong.
2.  How about some restrictions on the mentally ill instead of guns--can you imagine the pushback that will bring?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: sanjuanwormhatch on October 24, 2014, 12:38:07 PM
For the record, not once have I affiliated myself with one party or one "side".  Honestly, it's Friday and I'm really just arguing to kill time. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: sanjuanwormhatch on October 24, 2014, 12:55:27 PM
Quote from: Flatlander on October 24, 2014, 12:34:06 PM
Quote from: sanjuanwormhatch on October 24, 2014, 12:15:57 PM
So your stance is that mass shootings happen and we should do nothing to try to prevent them?

2.  How about some restrictions on the mentally ill instead of guns--can you imagine the pushback that will bring?
Question - do you think that we should "restrict" the mentally ill?  To what extent?  Curious. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: flatlander on October 24, 2014, 13:05:32 PM
Quote from: sanjuanwormhatch on October 24, 2014, 12:55:27 PM
Quote from: Flatlander on October 24, 2014, 12:34:06 PM
Quote from: sanjuanwormhatch on October 24, 2014, 12:15:57 PM
So your stance is that mass shootings happen and we should do nothing to try to prevent them?

2.  How about some restrictions on the mentally ill instead of guns--can you imagine the pushback that will bring?
Question - do you think that we should "restrict" the mentally ill?  To what extent?  Curious.

You're an attorney, correct?  Just for starters...can you imagine the massive privacy implications of trying to prevent people with mental illness from obtaining guns?  What constitutes mental illness?  Should people who try to commit suicide and fail be prevented from buying a gun?  Did you know suicides comprise the majority of gun deaths? 

How about hatchets--should crazy people be prevented from buying a hatchet?  How about people who recently converted to Islam?  Oh, what fun we can have with this one...
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: flatlander on October 24, 2014, 13:22:17 PM
Quote from: troutfanatic on October 24, 2014, 13:10:18 PM

I hope it never happens, but I know it will.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/police-hatchet-wielding-suspect-shot-by-officers/ar-BBaPxHN (http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/police-hatchet-wielding-suspect-shot-by-officers/ar-BBaPxHN)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: sanjuanwormhatch on October 24, 2014, 13:28:06 PM
Flatlander - not sure where you're going with this.  Hell, not even sure where I'm going with this.  Let me just ask you this.  If someone is bat shit crazy by every measurable out there, a clear cut case of mental illness, do you think it would be okay for the government to restrict his or her access and possession of a gun?  We can talk about hatchets later.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Grannyknot on October 24, 2014, 13:28:44 PM
Quote from: Flatlander on October 24, 2014, 13:22:17 PM
http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/police-hatchet-wielding-suspect-shot-by-officers/ar-BBaPxHN (http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/police-hatchet-wielding-suspect-shot-by-officers/ar-BBaPxHN)

Now THAT is a patriot act.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: flatlander on October 24, 2014, 13:43:03 PM
Quote from: sanjuanwormhatch on October 24, 2014, 13:28:06 PM
Flatlander - not sure where you're going with this.  Hell, not even sure where I'm going with this.  Let me just ask you this.  If someone is bat shit crazy by every measurable out there, a clear cut case of mental illness, do you think it would be okay for the government to restrict his or her access and possession of a gun?  We can talk about hatchets later.

Absolutely, I do.  But start thinking through the process of how you define crazy.  Where do you draw the line?  The problem is that there will be so much push-back from the mental health lobby that you inevitably will be forced to define "crazy" too narrowly, weakening the laws.   So, to prevent crazy people from being offended, we'll just take everyone's rights away.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: flatlander on October 24, 2014, 13:51:36 PM
Incidentally...the news is currently reporting a school shooting in Washington state
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: sanjuanwormhatch on October 24, 2014, 14:08:04 PM
You use the DSM.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: flatlander on October 24, 2014, 14:16:24 PM
Quote from: sanjuanwormhatch on October 24, 2014, 14:08:04 PM
You use the DSM.

I don't know the answer to this--do people who have been diagnosed schizophrenic as defined by the DSM have that somewhere in their public records if they haven't committed any sort of crime?  Would that show up in a background check?  Does it now?  I'm thinking it doesn't.  Wouldn't the uproar over privacy be enormous?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: sanjuanwormhatch on October 24, 2014, 14:19:27 PM
Honestly don't know.  In medical records, yes, obviously but those would be protected by HIPAA.  In short, don't know.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on November 06, 2014, 08:48:43 AM
I'd give my left testicle, because I don't really need it nor do I have $2300, for this rifle.

http://www.henryrifles.com/rifles/the-henry-original/ (http://www.henryrifles.com/rifles/the-henry-original/)

Speaking of testicles, check them regularly.  Peace.

http://adsoftheworld.com/media/TV/mcac_rhian_touches_herself (http://adsoftheworld.com/media/TV/mcac_rhian_touches_herself)

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Grannyknot on November 06, 2014, 09:00:38 AM
troutfanatic, those old guns are very cool.
I have 2 old shotguns, always wanted to start a collection, but just can't afford them right now.
Worst thing is, I'm afraid to shoot them. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: bmadd on November 06, 2014, 09:28:07 AM
What scatterguns you got Granny?

I'll try to get pictures up of mine later. I was wrong earlier when I said my Winchester was a model 12, it's the predecessor - Model 1897.

Also, going to look today for a new shotgun. Out with the old and in with something new I hope.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: sanjuanwormhatch on November 06, 2014, 09:33:26 AM
I love some old shotguns.  Used to browse all the gun auction sites for days on end looking at some of those guns.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Grannyknot on November 06, 2014, 09:43:58 AM
Quote from: bmadd on November 06, 2014, 09:28:07 AM
What scatterguns you got Granny?

I'll try to get pictures up of mine later. I was wrong earlier when I said my Winchester was a model 12, it's the predecessor - Model 1897.

Also, going to look today for a new shotgun. Out with the old and in with something new I hope.

I really don't know much about them.
One is a side by side Winchester model 21 from the 1930s.
The other is a Long Tom 16ga from, we think, from somewhere around 1910ish.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on November 06, 2014, 09:50:27 AM
The "old" is now in!  The old and the old style now have panache!  SJWH, bmadd, and Granny like old scatter guns, Doug likes old reels, and I like old camping/fishing equipment and timeworn gals.  Every pipe break I visit my pickup and fondle my Trapper Nelson pack; we have bonded.  And my wicker creel w/ leather harness is on its way  --- can then caress with each hand. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: sanjuanwormhatch on November 06, 2014, 10:26:13 AM
The model 21 might be worth something.  No idea on the other.  But that doesn't mean much because I'm far from an expert.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Grannyknot on November 06, 2014, 10:45:16 AM
Quote from: sanjuanwormhatch on November 06, 2014, 10:26:13 AM
The model 21 might be worth something.  No idea on the other.  But that doesn't mean much because I'm far from an expert.

The model 21 probably isn't worth much.  Its not in great shape, and dad mentioned he thought a piece or 2 had been replaced on it.
The long tom definitely isn't worth anything.  It was a sears & roebuck sold gun, mass produced by a company not known for quality.
I mainly just bought it because of some extremely dorky regional history behind it.  A man named Anthony Gregory is holding one in my avatar.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: bmadd on November 06, 2014, 10:45:36 AM
Long Tom looks to be around $300 at best. The Model 21 could be very valuable depending on shape, a quick search shows some going for $20k+.

My older guns aren't very collectable. They were made to hunt, and hunted hard they were. Most of them were cheap, massly made guns with lots still in circulation. The Remington Model 11 20 gauge I picked out of my late grandfather's collection after he passed. I'm going to preserve it and it will be my new dove gun. The Winchester 1897 was my wife's grandfather's gun. He used it to put food on the table for his family during the depression. The old Ithaca Hammerless sxs is a little bit of a mystery. It's from the inlaws as well. Believed to be my wife's great grandfather's gun. I'd like to restore it. It's in bad shape.

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: sanjuanwormhatch on November 06, 2014, 10:51:53 AM
Couldn't that Ithaca sxs be worth something? 

Let's hear more on this Anthony Gregory fella.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Grannyknot on November 06, 2014, 10:59:59 AM
Quote from: sanjuanwormhatch on November 06, 2014, 10:51:53 AM
Couldn't that Ithaca sxs be worth something? 

Let's hear more on this Anthony Gregory fella.

He is a descendant of Russell Greogry of cades cove.  Blah blah blah for about 3 hours.....don't want to put you to sleep.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: benben reincarnated on November 06, 2014, 11:10:16 AM
Quote from: Grannyknot on November 06, 2014, 10:59:59 AM
Quote from: sanjuanwormhatch on November 06, 2014, 10:51:53 AM
Couldn't that Ithaca sxs be worth something? 

Let's hear more on this Anthony Gregory fella.

He is a descendant of Russell Greogry of cades cove.  Blah blah blah for about 3 hours.....don't want to put you to sleep.

So your TN roots run fairly deep then I assume. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Grannyknot on November 06, 2014, 11:46:33 AM
Quote from: benben on November 06, 2014, 11:10:16 AM
Quote from: Grannyknot on November 06, 2014, 10:59:59 AM
Quote from: sanjuanwormhatch on November 06, 2014, 10:51:53 AM
Couldn't that Ithaca sxs be worth something? 

Let's hear more on this Anthony Gregory fella.

He is a descendant of Russell Greogry of cades cove.  Blah blah blah for about 3 hours.....don't want to put you to sleep.

So your TN roots run fairly deep then I assume.

No not really.  Regional history is just a hobby of mine.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: bmadd on November 06, 2014, 12:03:28 PM
Quote from: sanjuanwormhatch on November 06, 2014, 10:51:53 AM
Couldn't that Ithaca sxs be worth something? 

Let's hear more on this Anthony Gregory fella.

The Ithaca is in terrible shape. It's not worth much anyway, best ones on gunbroker are going $5-600. It's an old gun though. Best I can tell, since it's pre-serial number, puts it made between 1897-1903.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: bmadd on November 06, 2014, 12:04:40 PM
Granny, were those guns popular in that area or is there a specific story behind it?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on November 06, 2014, 12:33:55 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on November 06, 2014, 10:44:11 AM
I love evil black rifles

That's cool Steelie.  I don't love any inanimate object – can't think of any that I adore.   I do however like my black virtuous microwave and my white worthy wash machine.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on November 06, 2014, 13:10:33 PM
I do not shoot what I have now enough to justify buying another gun.  I will pick up another .357 smith or ruger in the next year or so, but I'm happy with what I have now.  I need to make it back to the shooting range soon.....
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on November 06, 2014, 13:18:59 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on November 06, 2014, 12:54:58 PM
I LOVE  a few of my less evil black pistols as well. Mudd I am sorry your incapable of love. There are support groups for that. Maybe you should 12 step your way to affection. Your obamacare should pay for that

I do love many things, all organic, living.  After some thoughtful head scratching, baby wipes may be the closest I come to loving a lifeless object.   
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on November 06, 2014, 13:42:57 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on November 06, 2014, 13:31:10 PM
It appears you have a foot fetish as well. Hey that's cool they have support groups for that as well. Unless you really love it then why stop

Oh yes, the foot and toe fetish, just one of many fixations I have.  I wish I could love my guns, but I can't, so I am relegated to the majority of American gun owners that can never join groups like the N.R.A. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Grannyknot on November 06, 2014, 13:51:19 PM
Quote from: bmadd on November 06, 2014, 12:04:40 PM
Granny, were those guns popular in that area or is there a specific story behind it?

The 21, I found in a closet at a relatives house in Kentucky.  Got no clue about its popularity.  I do know that it hasn't been shot since the 70s.
The long tom was a cheap bird gun that could easily be acquired from the sears & roebuck catalog.

Here are the boring bits:
Russell Gregory had a custom rifle that he hunted with in the mountains.  It was rumored to have a 40" barrel to improve accuracy, since there wasn't really rifled barrels at that point in time.
He called it Old Long Tom.  He was killed 3 years into the civil war, but before that, was visited by a Mr. William Baker, who he guided on a hunting expedition in the mountains.
Baker would go on to co-found the baker gun company, which was bought and sold about 5 different times, but produced the "Long Tom" shotgun, beginning around 1890.
The common characteristic of the Long Tom guns was their 36-40 inch barrel, which some say was inspired by Russell Gregory's gun.

Some say the picture of Anthony Gregory is him holding Russell's old gun, but in my opinion, it is clearly a shotgun, & not a black powder rifle, which considering the time period, Gregory's likely was.
It does appear to have a lengthy barrel, so I think it might be one of the Long Tom shot guns.

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I bought the gun from a guy in Townsend that ran a glorified pawn shop of old junk.  The kind of place a history channel show likes to exploit.
Anyway, there's loads more to the story, but unfortunately it isn't much more than a story, & some wishful thinking here & there. 
There's lots of conflicting information everywhere, from the circumstances around Russell's death to what happened to his gun.

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on November 06, 2014, 14:03:40 PM
Quote from: Grannyknot on November 06, 2014, 13:51:19 PM
Quote from: bmadd on November 06, 2014, 12:04:40 PM
Granny, were those guns popular in that area or is there a specific story behind it?

The 21, I found in a closet at a relatives house in Kentucky.  Got no clue about its popularity.  I do know that it hasn't been shot since the 70s.
The long tom was a cheap bird gun that could easily be acquired from the sears & roebuck catalog.

Here are the boring bits:
Russell Gregory had a custom rifle that he hunted with in the mountains.  It was rumored to have a 40" barrel to improve accuracy, since there wasn't really rifled barrels at that point in time.
He called it Old Long Tom.  He was killed 3 years into the civil war, but before that, was visited by a Mr. William Baker, who he guided on a hunting expedition in the mountains.
Baker would go on to co-found the baker gun company, which was bought and sold about 5 different times, but produced the "Long Tom" shotgun, beginning around 1890.
The common characteristic of the Long Tom guns was their 36-40 inch barrel, which some say was inspired by Russell Gregory's gun.

Some say the picture of Anthony Gregory is him holding Russell's old gun, but in my opinion, it is clearly a shotgun, & not a black powder rifle, which considering the time period, Gregory's likely was.
It does appear to have a lengthy barrel, so I think it might be one of the Long Tom shot guns.

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I bought the gun from a guy in Townsend that ran a glorified pawn shop of old junk.  The kind of place a history channel show likes to exploit.
Anyway, there's loads more to the story, but unfortunately it isn't much more than a story, & some wishful thinking here & there. 
There's lots of conflicting information everywhere, from the circumstances around Russell's death to what happened to his gun.

I enjoyed this.  Thanks for sharing.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: sanjuanwormhatch on November 06, 2014, 14:08:13 PM
Agree.  Story makes the gun much more valuable. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on November 06, 2014, 14:08:17 PM
Quote from: troutfanatic on November 06, 2014, 13:58:33 PM
Stephen,

have you acquired one of those critters again? Meaning the four-legged kind?

No, I have limited authority in my home, and when it comes to pets I have none.  There I said it.  At least my wife doesn't dress me.

As I stated earlier, my plan is a female pooch from the pound when I retire.  There are a couple of the mountain neighbor's dogs that I have semi-adopted.  Damn, I miss my dog that passed last fall.

Granny, I liked your story!!!
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: bmadd on November 06, 2014, 14:08:53 PM
Not that boring man. Useless knowledge probably, but not boring. I'll have to read a little more about him if there are some conspiracies regarding him. I knew him to be a settler of that area and just thought he was killed for supporting the union and defending his property.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Grannyknot on November 06, 2014, 14:22:27 PM
Quote from: bmadd on November 06, 2014, 14:08:53 PM
Not that boring man. Useless knowledge probably, but not boring. I'll have to read a little more about him if there are some conspiracies regarding him. I knew him to be a settler of that area and just thought he was killed for supporting the union and defending his property.

Most of cades cove actually supported the union, but kept it on the DL in an effort to keep good relationships with other communities.
They were fairly isolated & self sustaining, but still relied on trade with Tuckaleechee cove & Maryville.
The cove residents were constantly harassed by rouge bands of confederate soldiers.
They would come over the mountains looking for lodging, food, horses, & ammunition.
The citizens dealt with it for a while, but it started turning into more of a pillaging, and so Russell began leading a resistance against it.
The predominant theory was that he was killed by rebels that came over the mtn from North Carolina.
Some think he was shot in cold blood, with his back turned, some say it was a decent sized skirmish.

The kicker is that his son had joined a North Carolina confederate troop & some say he was part of the group that killed him.

And there's my thread hijack for the day.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: bmadd on November 06, 2014, 14:27:44 PM
Sounds like the plot of a movie I'd enjoy. Wooly - you're in the media biz, make it happen.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on November 06, 2014, 15:45:12 PM
John S. Mosby hid in Lynchburg after the war until he was pardoned.  Just a little pointless tidbit.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on November 06, 2014, 16:15:21 PM
Well now that the thread has gone to the civil war  /'/ One of my relatives was drafted into the union army and wrote the popular civil war era song

"tenting in the old campground"  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tenting_on_the_Old_Camp_Ground (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tenting_on_the_Old_Camp_Ground) 

click on this one for several links to listen to the song - https://search.yahoo.com/search?p=tenting+in+the+old+campground&ei=UTF-8&fr=moz35 (https://search.yahoo.com/search?p=tenting+in+the+old+campground&ei=UTF-8&fr=moz35)

I clicked through a few of them and this one will send a chill up your spine. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K9kfwle5Cqg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K9kfwle5Cqg)

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: benben reincarnated on November 06, 2014, 17:20:32 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on November 06, 2014, 16:20:51 PM
I have some grape shot I found on a family farm outside of chattanooga when I was a kid

Here's some grape shot I collected some time ago as well.  Shit is heavy and dense, would give you a hell of a headache if hit with it.

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Quote from: troutfanatic on November 06, 2014, 15:25:14 PM
I also have an officer's saber (CSA) but it is in pathetic condition. I inherited it after my Grandparents died. I have no real idea what the origin is.

I have a saber as well.  It was passed down to me and as the story goes my grandfather and his brother found it at the site of a former Civil War battle.  It is manufactured by Horstmann and Sons, Philadelphia on the reverse side (can be made out on the shoulder of the blade).  From what I found out it was a infantry officers sword, coulda been either carried by either side despite the location it was manufactured. 

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: bmadd on November 06, 2014, 18:31:01 PM
Buying a new shotgun as I type V:;
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: bmadd on November 06, 2014, 22:56:17 PM
New hunting partner
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Grannyknot on November 07, 2014, 08:43:55 AM
bmadd, very nice.
My dad got a super black eagle a few years back.
He had always shot modest guns for his whole life and finally decided to spoil himself.
He loves it & has been known to clean it in the blind between flocks.
They went to Kansas last year.  Everyone flew, but he elected to drive by himself to avoid the airline touching it.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: bmadd on November 07, 2014, 09:54:35 AM
Traded in a Browning Gold for this. Bought the gold when I was 18. It was the waterfowl gun to have then. 3 1/2" chamber, camo the whole nine. I was dumb then. Bought it without ever shouldering the gun. It never fit me good and I could never shoot consistently with it.
This gun fits great. It's not near as heavy and will be much easier to clean. The wood will need a little extra attention but will have much more character than a camo gun that chips. Only a 3" chamber but that's all I've shot the last 4 years anyway.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: tomato can on November 07, 2014, 20:28:30 PM
that montefeltro is a nice gun.  I almost got one of those.  I ended up getting a berretta al391 cause it fit better.  I'll have to post some pics when I can remember the combo to my gun safe.  Been vexing me for days...
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on November 07, 2014, 22:27:36 PM
I, too, appreciate fine firearms and have a few.  My AL391 Teknys is out for Cerakoting right now, so I'll post pics upon return to my hands. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on November 09, 2014, 07:58:23 AM

Quote from: troutfanatic on November 08, 2014, 18:22:00 PM
Quote from: rbphoto on November 07, 2014, 22:27:36 PM
I, too, appreciate fine firearms and have a few.  My AL391 Teknys is out for Cerakoting right now, so I'll post pics upon return to my hands.

Cerakote...

I knew there was a reason why I like you.

I cerakote my knives.

I wanted to send it out for Ionbond, but Cerakote was less expensive and local.

I hope to have my 92FS frame koted for my oldest son before I get the front sight drilled for fiber optic.  It will be his 21st b-day present, along with a few of the goodies from the Wilson Combat shop.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on November 09, 2014, 17:46:39 PM
Just for old times sake, I'd like to buy a M60. My favorite gun. Point and shoot everything.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: benben reincarnated on November 09, 2014, 19:15:05 PM
This to me is the fuck all of guns.

http://youtu.be/-L0ZAGOuaqg

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: The Dude on November 10, 2014, 06:49:21 AM

Quote from: Phil on November 09, 2014, 17:46:39 PM
Just for old times sake, I'd like to buy a M60. My favorite gun. Point and shoot everything.

One M-60 could change the tide of a small arms battle. Just the presence of one with you is a comforting feeling, but I always felt like you couldn't get the full use out of them because the barrel got hot too fast with those tracer rounds and even with two barrels it was like the sumbitch would be glowing red hot just about the time you got going good. I never fired the 240B to see what it was like.
Title: Re: For the love of guns (hot barrel)
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on November 10, 2014, 09:29:28 AM
Quote from: The Dude on November 10, 2014, 06:49:21 AM
..... the barrel got hot too fast

I suppose you can make the barrel hot on most any firearm.

My first deer:  There was almost a foot of snow on the ground.  My dad and I split up, planning to meet later that afternoon.  While sneaking along a white oak flat I caught a motion to my right.  It was a respectable buck (6 pts.).  I took a shot, and as the buck ran past I emptied the 94, clicking an empty chamber, and spotting a dangling front leg.  I reloaded and yes, the barrel was hot!  The trail was easy to follow in the snow; I slipped up behind the animal and put one in its neck.  My dad backtracked to see that I was ok.  His first words, before he saw the dead animal, were 'who with an automatic was shooting'.  Then after seeing the deer, and a brief, I mean very fleeting, 'well done', he proceeded to sternly tutor me on the downsides of firing willy-nilly.   

To this day, I am a piss-poor shot with a rifle.  I still enjoy lever actions and even bolts, but if I want to hit anything it needs to be with a single shot.  It is impossible to get a single shot to sound and feel like a hot barreled automatic. 

Recollecting those wonderful kid days.  Peace.


Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on November 10, 2014, 16:52:50 PM
The main problem with the M60 was that the bandoleers would tend to jam. If ya carved up a C-rat can just right, it would fit right into the feedway and prevent the thing from jamming. I never cared about the barrel getting too hot. Screw that. The least of my worries at the time. It was a love/hate relationship, but was a good gun.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 10, 2014, 18:53:41 PM
I like pre-64 Winchester model 70 ' and belgium brownings. Own a couple. They are never shot and babied.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 10, 2014, 18:55:36 PM
Them damn black guns are toys. Lol. If it ain't a shotgun, it should have a fucking walnut stock and a bolt/lever. Lol are you little boys with your little plastic toys.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 10, 2014, 18:57:57 PM
Lol. No they don't Andrew. They have plastic
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 10, 2014, 18:59:36 PM
Plastic has two purposes, making 'do-hikeys' or 'thingama-jiggers" and making things which pentrate one's asshole/vajayay
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 10, 2014, 19:03:27 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on November 10, 2014, 19:01:07 PM
I used a plastic gun in iraq it made holes in things just fine and it didn't weigh 50 lbs
Did you put it in your butt?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on November 10, 2014, 19:08:42 PM
I have one of these "plastic" guns.  It was almost good enough for Chris McCandless (Into the Wild), but not quite. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 10, 2014, 19:18:11 PM
Quote from: troutfanatic on November 10, 2014, 19:17:41 PM
Quote from: wildmttrout on November 10, 2014, 18:55:36 PM
Them damn black guns are toys. Lol. If it ain't a shotgun, it should have a fucking walnut stock and a bolt/lever. Lol are you little boys with your little plastic toys.

I guess you lump the M1A and M14 in with that assumption too? Mine has a walnut stock.
Lol. Like I give a fuck about what you have. Lol
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 10, 2014, 19:21:50 PM
Haha. Like, in my butt? Where the other plastic things are designed to go? In people's butt hole?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 10, 2014, 19:24:39 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on November 10, 2014, 19:23:22 PM
I believe those are silicone
I bet they are "polymer"
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 10, 2014, 19:27:42 PM
Quote from: troutfanatic on November 10, 2014, 19:25:51 PM
Quote from: wildmttrout on November 10, 2014, 19:21:50 PM
Haha. Like, in my butt? Where the other plastic things are designed to go? In people's butt hole?


Yes. in YOUR butthole like a good little lib douche -+;
Look man, I am not the guy that owns the dildo gun.

But seriously,  have you stuck it up your butt yet?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 10, 2014, 19:31:34 PM
Cant. It's not plastic. Too much workman's ship. Butt is only for toys.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 10, 2014, 19:34:28 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on November 10, 2014, 19:33:10 PM
hmmm someone has a buttsex fantasy. first its feet now its buttsex
I just wish I owned a good dildo gun. Hard to find a good one these days.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 10, 2014, 19:38:12 PM
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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on November 10, 2014, 19:39:20 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on November 10, 2014, 19:33:10 PM
hmmm someone has a buttsex fantasy. first its feet now its buttsex

Feet, OK, but the other ain't for me.

I also have 2 TC Encores with plastic stocks, both in 7mm08.  Synthetic stocks are ok.

"It's your thing, do what you wanna do"

http://youtu.be/MD-9eOWsp8o (http://youtu.be/MD-9eOWsp8o)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 10, 2014, 19:41:57 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood on November 10, 2014, 19:39:20 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on November 10, 2014, 19:33:10 PM
hmmm someone has a buttsex fantasy. first its feet now its buttsex

Feet, OK, but the other ain't for me.

I also have 2 TC Encores with plastic stocks, both in 7mm08.  Synthetic stocks are ok.

"It's your thing, do what you wanna do"

http://youtu.be/MD-9eOWsp8o (http://youtu.be/MD-9eOWsp8o)
You put up your butt yet?  I've heard it's the thing to do these days.

Edit: I went political and that is bad.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: benben reincarnated on November 10, 2014, 19:48:20 PM
G is drizunk.

Jamie Foxx feat. T-Pain - Blame It ft. T-Pain (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rfjtpp90lu8#)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 10, 2014, 19:54:44 PM
Lol. Yall just got STEAMROLLER by the Trollmatic 500

Lol
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 10, 2014, 19:59:26 PM
Dylar' brand of trolling is simplistic and normal. He uses the "shock factor" as his main weapon.

Just not my taste.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 10, 2014, 20:05:28 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on November 10, 2014, 20:00:43 PM
gayson goes straight to the buttsex
Says the plastic gun guy.

I'm not afraid of buttsecks.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dee-Vo on November 10, 2014, 20:08:43 PM
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9-xc6_GhkZg
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 10, 2014, 20:10:52 PM
Quote from: wademaster on November 10, 2014, 20:08:43 PM
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9-xc6_GhkZg
Go back to the kids table.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on November 10, 2014, 20:11:23 PM
Now I know why WMT likes the SEC.

http://youtu.be/1Kan9UaTLQs (http://youtu.be/1Kan9UaTLQs)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 10, 2014, 20:11:39 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on November 10, 2014, 20:09:42 PM
i guess your trolling for buttsex
And I got a shit ton of hits itt.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 10, 2014, 20:21:17 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on November 10, 2014, 20:16:55 PM
so your butt got tons of hits?
I am wearing chaps setting in my recliner. So I guess it did. Lol. Y'all gay after some WMT ass. Lol. But you can't have it tho
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 10, 2014, 20:26:30 PM
Lol. What now boys?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: benben reincarnated on November 10, 2014, 20:32:07 PM

Quote from: wildmttrout on November 10, 2014, 20:26:30 PM
Lol. What now boys?


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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 10, 2014, 20:40:25 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on November 10, 2014, 20:34:17 PM
hey if being anally raped is your thing more power to ya. i honestly dont care what you like stuck up your discharge valve
But I bet you kinda do tho
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on November 10, 2014, 23:01:34 PM
Allow me to put some real manliness back into this thread . . .

Will be used to modificate some guns, I am certain:

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: sanjuanwormhatch on November 11, 2014, 09:43:58 AM
Speaking of WMT and trolling, I distinctly remember one particularly hilarious battle on a forum not to be named over broken rods.  Dude man said he NEVER broke rods and WMT said otherwise.  A poll was started about how many rods were broken and what section and dude man LOST IT.  Am I remembering that right?  If not, don't spoil the fun.  Who said the interweb can't be entertaining?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: RiverbumCO on November 11, 2014, 11:08:31 AM
That same cat also quit the forum shortly after.  Kept on about how a 2wt was better at subduing large trouts than a 5-6-7 wt.  Said we could come listen to his seminar about it in Greensboro (which never happened).

But, GUNS.  fitting to go sight in a 2506, a 3006, and 22 mag.  Cheers.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on November 11, 2014, 11:50:45 AM
I'm an unapologetic liberal, but not when it comes to guns. Putting a trigger lock on a gun means that you cannot fire it when you need to. Somebody breaks into my house -- I don't want to have to unlock a trigger lock and load the frigging gun. I'll be dead by then. I keep them loaded.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 20, 2014, 18:45:16 PM
Quote from: Shiite or Shinola on November 20, 2014, 18:39:14 PM
Guns don't kill people, blue gum nigras with guns kill people.

...and occasionally mentally disturbed gooks.
Old troll is old
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 20, 2014, 18:50:41 PM
Quote from: Shiite or Shinola on November 20, 2014, 18:49:56 PM
Quote from: wildmttrout on November 20, 2014, 18:45:16 PM
Quote from: Shiite or Shinola on November 20, 2014, 18:39:14 PM
Guns don't kill people, blue gum nigras with guns kill people.

...and occasionally mentally disturbed gooks.
Old troll is old

Old trolls are the best.  Sort of like old whiskey.  Now 'dead' definitely beats 'old' when it comes to blue gum, but hey, diversity is the spice of life.
Meh.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Aka on November 20, 2014, 22:25:14 PM
Look at me, look at me. Give me attention.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Grannyknot on November 21, 2014, 08:25:35 AM
Quote from: AKAaron on November 20, 2014, 22:25:14 PM
Look at me, look at me. Give me attention.

don't forget, "I'm different just like everybody else".
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on November 21, 2014, 10:55:45 AM
Poll added.  You can vote 69 times and change your vote as many times as you like.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on November 23, 2014, 17:00:40 PM
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(http://s103.photobucket.com/user/BigJSV2/media/7BF8450E-8766-4747-B5B3-C0ED9F9B366E_zpsbvkpgtvk.jpg.html)

I think I enjoy cleaning my guns as much as I do shooting them.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on November 23, 2014, 17:19:07 PM
Quote from: Big J on November 23, 2014, 17:00:40 PM
I think I enjoy cleaning my guns as much as I do shooting them.

Big J., you should have joined up, or at least tried like Ernest T. Bass.

"Clean your gun, jump in the truck."

http://youtu.be/V4Gmd7vO4Zg (http://youtu.be/V4Gmd7vO4Zg)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Onslow on November 23, 2014, 17:25:17 PM
QuoteMancard reissued  V:;

Don't need a fucking mancard.  Johnson power is all one needs
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on November 23, 2014, 18:10:21 PM
Quote from: troutfanatic on November 23, 2014, 17:30:42 PM
A gun may be compensatory according to Freud, but I need no compensation.

besides Frued was a junkie and a toolbag.

I don't think Freud said/believed that a gun may compensate for a tiny unit.  I am not even sure he referenced the male phallus with the words gun/weapon in some sort of symbolism.

Research the topic, but I believe it was Playboy that first used guns to make fun of a small penis, in a very loose interpretation, a very liberal analysis, of what they and others thought Freud was saying. 

Peace, you bunch of gun loving nuts!!!
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on November 23, 2014, 18:51:23 PM
Quote from: troutfanatic on November 23, 2014, 18:15:18 PM
You said, "you bunch of gun loving nuts".

you are a gun owner; reconcile yourself!

Yes, but I don't love my guns --- no more than my flush toilet, or my microwave, or my old claw hammer. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on November 23, 2014, 19:04:54 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on November 23, 2014, 18:55:36 PM
Good for you I guess that makes you superior.

Nope, not at all.  I've not felt superior for almost 40 years.  I was 18 and beat out a star football player for the affections of a gorgeous nympho; it only lasted 3 weeks, but for those brief 21 days I was superior to that walnut headed no-neck Neanderthal.

Steelie, go back to cleaning your Glocks.  You're using the wrong bait.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: benben reincarnated on November 23, 2014, 20:02:02 PM
I do
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on November 23, 2014, 20:12:24 PM
My goodness. I just wanted to say I enjoy cleaning guns after I shot them. I like my SIGs clean.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on November 23, 2014, 20:15:41 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on November 23, 2014, 20:14:27 PM
Sig makes a great pistol. I am looking at the 320 for my next pistol.

I've been eyeballing the 320 as well.  Surprised that Sig decided to add a striker fire pistol to their lineup. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on November 23, 2014, 20:19:00 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on November 23, 2014, 20:17:03 PM
Competition is getting tough. I am big fan of striker fired. I like the modularity of it also

That little gun in the picture is a subcompact P250 which is a modular DA gun.  Sig really did good on the modular idea.  You can take out the fire control unit and mail the frame, slide, and barrel since it isn't a "firearm". 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on November 23, 2014, 20:32:09 PM
I may or may not agree, but it is an interesting perspective. 

http://www.nybooks.com/blogs/nyrblog/2012/dec/15/our-moloch/ (http://www.nybooks.com/blogs/nyrblog/2012/dec/15/our-moloch/)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on November 24, 2014, 17:56:11 PM
If you are not in the military, you don't need all those fancy guns.
A good 12 gauge pump with the plug removed and 4 double-aught shells, along with a decent revolver should do the trick. I like the .357 Magnum with Hyshok shells.Guests are not allowed to view images in posts, please Register or Login
.
If that doesn't get home defense done, you are dead anyway.
Revolvers don't jam.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 24, 2014, 18:37:45 PM
My glock was cleaned once. Ain't seen it since
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on November 24, 2014, 19:15:43 PM
I'm not in the military anymore, and don't work an M60 anymore. I don't clean my weapons every day. I find revolvers more reliable than semis if they have been sitting around for a while. I haven't had to use a weapon for a long time on an enemy, and hope to never do it again. I'm also not in prison for murder, thank Gawd. That's just me. Hate if you want to.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: RiverbumCO on November 24, 2014, 19:20:06 PM
I bought a Taurus TCP 380 today. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: FlyFisher22 on November 24, 2014, 19:59:11 PM
Quote from: troutfanatic on November 23, 2014, 20:22:39 PM
momma wants an Hk 2000 in 9mm and I want a Glock27 as our next purchases.

Sold a Glock 27 not too long ago. Had it for years, shot it a lot in the begining and never really liked. Fit my hand for shit and didn't point well for me. Was a little better with the mag extension but never great for me.....
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: driver on November 24, 2014, 23:17:01 PM
Quote from: troutfanatic on November 24, 2014, 21:22:04 PM
Yes but not sure if I want a 23 or a 27

I need a new shotgun first and I would like a new deer rifle. Sick of my 7600.

The shotgun will be a red label- Aafes has a 12 Ga. for 1140.00

the rifle? Maybe a 700 in .270... 30-06 is overated for deer.

I've had a 700 in .270 for 15 years. Solid gun. I just can't shoot anything but Federal Premium out of it. Any other brand is all over the place. The .270 is so much flatter shooting than a 30-06.

If I were going to purchase a o/u new, I would go 20 Ga. 12 Ga is overrated for birds  :P Assuming you are getting this for birds
Advantages are a lighter gun and a not so sore shoulder.  My o/u is a 12 gauge, I paid $250 for it, so I won't complain about it too much.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: RiverbumCO on November 25, 2014, 07:07:24 AM
270 is MUCH flatter shootinf than 3006?

Cmon.  Youre talking a couple inches at 300 yds with a 20 grain heavier bullet.

Overrated for deer?    It doesnt kill them dead enough?

Im not a 3006 fanboy, but that is retarded.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on November 25, 2014, 09:44:38 AM
get a .243

Your shoulder will love you.

Kids will enjoy shooting it.

It is lightweight and has a nice trajectory.

More than enough for Eastern Whitetails.

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: sanjuanwormhatch on November 25, 2014, 09:47:42 AM
I'd like to buy a new shotgun.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: RiverbumCO on November 25, 2014, 09:51:04 AM
Tikka t3 lite in 2506.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: bmadd on November 25, 2014, 09:57:28 AM
My dad and grandad bought me my first deer rifle when I was 14. A Ruger Mark II .243. From 10-14 I borrowed a Remington 700 in the same caliber from my grandfather. I'd say 95% of the fields I grew up hunting offered shots less than 100 yards and the other 5% would have been less than 175 tops. .243 was light, shot straight, and did enough to bring the deer down without doing an extra damage to the meat if your shot was a little off. My rifle has brought down several deer for myself. It was even responsible for the first deer of my little cousin, a nice little 8 point.

As for shotguns, I haven't gotten to shoot at many ducks (only 2 sadly), but I love the new Montefeltro. I highly recommend it for anyone looking for a semi auto.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on November 25, 2014, 10:04:34 AM
I want to say Stephen has a single shot .243 he swears by for deer.  I do not hunt though.  Fish to much to take up hunting.  I will say though that I enjoyed shooting my lever action Henry.  I've been eyeballing the .357 mag lever actions again.  If I find one that pops up for the right price I may jump on it. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: RiverbumCO on November 25, 2014, 10:18:16 AM
I want a 44 mag lever.  I also want a Smith and Wesson m&p 1522.  Found a pawn shop copy for 350 cash. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on November 25, 2014, 10:25:00 AM
Quote from: RiverbumCO on November 25, 2014, 10:18:16 AM
I want a 44 mag lever.  I also want a Smith and Wesson m&p 1522.  Found a pawn shop copy for 350 cash.

Only thing that has me wanting a .357 is the cost .38 special is equivalent to 9mm.  It can also handle some stout .357 loads. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dee-Vo on November 25, 2014, 11:06:35 AM
Quote from: RiverbumCO on November 25, 2014, 10:18:16 AM
I want a 44 mag lever.

Me too. Almost bought one a while back, wish I wouldve.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: benben reincarnated on November 25, 2014, 12:17:56 PM
My own first deer rifle was a Marlin 30-30.  A great all around gun for deer.  You never can see far enough in the woods around here to need to max out the range on that round anyway. 

I'll second the .270 as well.  My grandfather bought a Remington pump action .270 a long time ago and that's all he ever used.  He killed more deer with that gun than anyone I know. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Aka on November 25, 2014, 14:04:27 PM
I started hunting at 5. My brothers (one 7 the other 9) and I would get a box of .22 rounds from our dad and get sent out to shoot grouse, we called them spruce hens where I'm from.

I always used a 30-06 for moose, which is a fine gun for them. I've never hunted deer although I have a back strap from one in my freezer. We used .270's for salmon.

Back to .22's for a minute. I'm hoping to get an old pump action .22 that was my grandfathers, soon. It's a beauty, I'll post pics once I have it.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: benben reincarnated on November 25, 2014, 17:29:01 PM
Quote from: AKAaron on November 25, 2014, 14:04:27 PM
I started hunting at 5. My brothers (one 7 the other 9) and I would get a box of .22 rounds from our dad and get sent out to shoot grouse, we called them spruce hens where I'm from.

I always used a 30-06 for moose, which is a fine gun for them. I've never hunted deer although I have a back strap from one in my freezer. We used .270's for salmon.

Back to .22's for a minute. I'm hoping to get an old pump action .22 that was my grandfathers, soon. It's a beauty, I'll post pics once I have it.

You funny man, liberals don't shoot guns. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on November 25, 2014, 17:38:30 PM
"You funny man, liberals don't shoot guns. "

This one does.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: benben reincarnated on November 25, 2014, 18:41:16 PM
Quote from: troutfanatic on November 25, 2014, 18:17:28 PM
Quote from: Phil on November 25, 2014, 17:38:30 PM
"You funny man, liberals don't shoot guns. "

This one does.

The question lies in whether liberals will hand over their guns when the komrade in chief demands it or conducts more executive actions?

How does that play out in the United States of America?  The president of the United States of America just up and says, "hey everybody, let me have your guns", and we just turn them all in?

So is this why I need to go buy an assault rifle, so when this happens I can say "hell no!", and go down shooting?

What are these other alternatives you were alluding to as it relates to guns stemming from executive action?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: benben reincarnated on November 25, 2014, 18:57:23 PM
I wouldn't care to guess how expensive an assault rife is these days, nor show any interest beyond that in actually purchasing one.  I just can't justify a need.  Hell everyone needs a hobby though, I have a few, you have yours. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on November 25, 2014, 19:03:02 PM
Quote from: troutfanatic on November 25, 2014, 18:17:28 PM
The question lies in whether liberals will hand over their guns when the komrade in chief demands it or conducts more executive actions?

Most liberals and conservatives that own guns and are not NRA members probably don't worry about such silliness.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 25, 2014, 19:05:01 PM
Now here is a damn topic finally.

270 vs 30/06

Imma 270 fan boy. Have an early 90's tika hunter in 270 with walnut stock and a Leopold vari-x iii 3.5×10 50mm. Shoot hand-loaded rounds, 135 grain nosler/Sierra boat tail soft points and 55.5 grains of 2350 hodgons powder. Cuts bullet holes at 300 yards from a bench.

I like a 270 over an 06 since it has a wider variety of lighter bullets which shoot more consistent. Last time I checked, a 90 grain btsp could hold its own at 200-300 yards in that combo. 06 has a larger variety of heavier loads, but I prefer a 300 win mag in anything over 150 grains.

Also, Jack O'Connor was a 270 man. That is enough for me.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 25, 2014, 19:12:21 PM
Also own a couple 243's. Sako forester and a belgium browning (medallion grade) 243. That bitch has the original browning scope and mounts, pencil barrel,  hand checked walnut stock, hand engraved receiver, Sako action, and gold plated trigger. Never shot it. Dad has. The Sako will fucking drive nails.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 25, 2014, 19:15:00 PM
Dream gun:

Safari grade,  belgium browning 270

Pre-64 Winchester model 70 300 win mag
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on November 25, 2014, 19:24:56 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on November 25, 2014, 19:06:00 PM
Well there ya go argument over the bug guy has spoken

Rambo, I had no idea it was an argument; I thought TF asked a question.  Enlighten me, what are we arguing? 

Jacob was close.  I had a .243 when I was a kid --- traded it for a PSE bow.  Now I have TC single shot in 7mm08.

The lever action 44 mag you guys want would be a hoot.  I'd also like to own a Savage bolt in .308; I have hunting friends that say they shoot factory ammo great right out of the box – no need to bed barrel or tweak the trigger or play with loads.   
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: RiverbumCO on November 25, 2014, 19:27:08 PM
Welp.  I traded a 1978 Remington 742 woodsmaster BDL 3006 Jam o matic for the Smith and Wesson M&P 1522.  It is fucking awesome too.

also, no 7mm Rem Mag love?  Great round.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 25, 2014, 19:31:20 PM
Quote from: RiverbumCO on November 25, 2014, 19:27:08 PM
Welp.  I traded a 1978 Remington 742 woodsmaster BDL 3006 Jam o matic for the Smith and Wesson M&P 1522.  It is fucking awesome too.

also, no 7mm Rem Mag love?  Great round.
Meh, 7 mag weatherby over the rem imo. Not a rem fan, but that is just me. I've reloaded a bunch of 7mm rem tho. Tough to get dialed in that gun. Have a few loads with 150 grains which shoot good
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 25, 2014, 20:18:57 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on November 25, 2014, 20:13:25 PM
i am 270 fanboy. i killed many deer with one. i like the caliber paired with a nosler ballistic tip
New ballistic tips are light years above the old ones. They seem to hold together really well and create a hell of a mushroom. Shoot the 165 nosler ballistic tip in the 300. Hell of a round.

Big nosler and Sierra fan.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: RiverbumCO on November 25, 2014, 20:22:58 PM
Game Kings outta my 25-06.

I shoot the Noslers out tha 7mm.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 25, 2014, 20:28:43 PM
Quote from: steelrain202 on November 25, 2014, 20:23:42 PM
massive hemorrhaging is the goal
Wound channel and anti-fragmentation for me. I want one shot to knock his dick in the dirt. But then again, I haven't shot a deer in over 5 years and the last one was a doe which traveled 3 feet post shot. Might changed that this week.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on November 25, 2014, 21:50:31 PM
Quote from: troutfanatic on November 25, 2014, 20:46:09 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood on November 25, 2014, 19:03:02 PM
Quote from: troutfanatic on November 25, 2014, 18:17:28 PM
The question lies in whether liberals will hand over their guns when the komrade in chief demands it or conducts more executive actions?

Most liberals and conservatives that own guns and are not NRA members probably don't worry about such silliness.

Quit being a #twatwaffle and using humor to back out of a real discussion. You assume too much about me. I am neither a republican or an NRA member...
Are you a member of CPUSA?

Read my statement again.  I assume nothing concerning you, nor was it meant as humor.  It was an honest, how-I-feel response to the question you asked.  I did not say you were an NRA member or a republican.  If you are going to get your thong in a bind, then you should have addressed my implication that your assumed paranoia is silly.

In my close circle I have gun owning friends on the right and left, all are hunters.  I don't think any are NRA members but I could be mistaken on a few.   We communicate on a regular basis and they do have trepidations about a lot of stuff, BUT never have they broached the concern of handing over their guns to the government or any other authority.   Therefore, I said "most" and "probably" based on my own personal interactions.

Now take your Midol and go to bed.
 
Let me say, I know many military and ex-military, my wife included, plus many fishing, camping and hunting pals.  We even had a young man live in our home rent-free for over a year after he returned from Iraq and ran into a difficult marital situation.  He was a good kid and needed a break.  It was nothing special on my part or the Mrs.; we had the unused room.   Not one of these servants of the USA felt the need to engage in chest-thumping. 

And no I am not a member of CPUSA.  I have no idea of the meaning of CPUSA. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on November 25, 2014, 22:17:00 PM
While I believe the .270 is a fine round and the modern ammo choices are amazing, I am accurate enough with my .30-06 to hit a human-size target out to 600 meters. I came very, very close to building a 300Winmag about 15 yrs ago to go for the 1000yd range and then started looking at the overall cost.

I have exploded coyotes at 35 yds with 110gr hollow points, dropped (where it stood) 170 lb whitetail at 120yds with a single CNS (c-spine) shot, and hit more 300 yd targets in the 10 ring than I can count with my .30-06 Rem 700.  It is more about learning how to shoot well than it is caliber, trajectory, or bullet or rifle manufacturer.

With that said, I miss shooting regularly.

Last whitetail I killed was a 14" nasal penetration to c-spine (no exit wound) with a .35 Rem gr soft point through iron sights at 12 paces while stalking. I can't sit still in the woods and would rather drive deer to others or stalk them.

I plan to hunt with my 10mm for the foreseeable future.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: RiverbumCO on November 26, 2014, 10:20:52 AM
I want this now.


http://youtu.be/s3dKvG3n3a8 (http://youtu.be/s3dKvG3n3a8)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: RiverbumCO on November 26, 2014, 11:23:40 AM
Savage Bolt.  Pretty popular caliber really.  Perfect for deer/antelope and plenty of sub 100 gr bullet choices for yotes.  Its a necked down 3006 cartridge tonfit a .25 projectile.  HOT round.  Very fast.  I shoot 117 gr out of mine.  Recoil is very minimal, but more than .243.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on November 26, 2014, 11:24:18 AM
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My grandfather's Springfield 1884 trapdoor. Mine now. Henheh.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 26, 2014, 11:35:24 AM


Quote from: troutfanatic on November 26, 2014, 11:29:28 AM
Quote from: RiverbumCO on November 26, 2014, 11:23:40 AM
Savage Bolt.  Pretty popular caliber really.  Perfect for deer/antelope and plenty of sub 100 gr bullet choices for yotes.  Its a necked down 3006 cartridge tonfit a .25 projectile.  HOT round.  Very fast.  I shoot 117 gr out of mine.  Recoil is very minimal, but more than .243.

Nah man, familiar with the round, just never shot one. The Savage you own, is it one of the newer synthetic stocked, accutrigger guns?

I'm thinking I need to shoot one of these a few times and see if I like it before I jump off and buy a .243 or a .270. I have shot both of them. I will admit from someone's earlier comment, a Ruger #1 in .243 would be a mighty fine rifle. My stepfather has one and I have shot it. I really liked it and accurate as fukkall.

Anything new I buy must come with dies in that same purchase. I only began to mess around with reloading three years ago. I currently do: .223, 5.56, .30-06, .308 and 7.92x57. Have not dabbled in pistol rounds yet.

Holler at me if you get a 243 or 270; I've got those loads on lock down. Probably have a good one for 25/06 somewhere.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: natureboy on November 26, 2014, 11:47:14 AM
I passed on a Ruger #1, staninless/laminate 25-06 topped with a x50 Nikon at the local pawn shop a couple years ago, still regret it.  :embarassed:  They currently have a 10ga Browning that's talking to me...

Any of you guys ever rebuild a M77 MkII?  I've got an all weather 7mm that I haven't been satisfied with the accuracy, thinking about bedding and a new trigger this winter.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: RiverbumCO on November 26, 2014, 11:53:07 AM
Mine is an Axis sans accutrigger.  Cheapo gun that shoots good with a stainless barrel I dont have to worry about bangin around.  I believe theres a DIY trigger mod for mine that takes 5 min and cuts two lbs off.  Mounted with a 3 9 40 Nikon Monarch she lights up the evening sky.  Was sick of worrying about my Rem 700 bdl while in the woods.  My next gun will hopefully be a TC Pro Hunter in .264 Win Mag.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: benben reincarnated on November 26, 2014, 14:33:52 PM
Cool gun Phil.  This is my 1873 trap door that's been handed down to me.  Missing the shoulder strap, but it does have the cleaning rod still.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on November 26, 2014, 14:40:54 PM
I also treasure my grandpa's 1898 Krag.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: benben reincarnated on November 26, 2014, 14:50:12 PM
That Krag is cool gun too.  You can't beat old classics.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: benben reincarnated on November 26, 2014, 14:55:32 PM
This just in:

http://www.wlos.com/news/features/top-stories/stories/man-steals-ar15-walmart-18679.shtml (http://www.wlos.com/news/features/top-stories/stories/man-steals-ar15-walmart-18679.shtml)


Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dee-Vo on November 26, 2014, 15:04:03 PM
Quote from: Shiite or Shinola on November 26, 2014, 15:00:17 PM
Quote from: benben on November 26, 2014, 14:55:32 PM
This just in:

http://www.wlos.com/news/features/top-stories/stories/man-steals-ar15-walmart-18679.shtml (http://www.wlos.com/news/features/top-stories/stories/man-steals-ar15-walmart-18679.shtml)

It would help if he didn't look like every single pillhead in WNC.

Maybe the vehicle description will narrow it down.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dee-Vo on November 26, 2014, 15:25:51 PM
Quote from: Shiite or Shinola on November 26, 2014, 15:06:01 PM
Plenty of white sedans out there.

I see you didn't catch the sarcasm.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: benben reincarnated on November 26, 2014, 17:16:13 PM

Quote from: troutfanatic on November 26, 2014, 16:30:16 PM
Nothing like a good article about a crime involving an AR to re-flame the thread.

thanks Ben

Thank me later.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on November 26, 2014, 17:45:05 PM
My grandfather used the Krag in the Spanish-American war.  He was born in 1863.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: RiverbumCO on November 26, 2014, 19:56:19 PM
I think the 1522 just claimed its first life.  A possum.  Damn this gun is fun.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: benben reincarnated on November 26, 2014, 19:57:10 PM
Quote from: troutfanatic on November 26, 2014, 19:52:27 PM
Quote from: benben on November 26, 2014, 17:16:13 PM

Quote from: troutfanatic on November 26, 2014, 16:30:16 PM
Nothing like a good article about a crime involving an AR to re-flame the thread.

thanks Ben

Thank me later.

I just did

Not late enough.  Wait.  Calm down.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on November 27, 2014, 10:39:56 AM
Quote from: RiverbumCO on November 25, 2014, 10:18:16 AM
I want a 44 mag lever.

http://www.vaguntrader.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/811421/gonew/1#UNREAD (http://www.vaguntrader.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/811421/gonew/1#UNREAD)

Forget lever action RBC, get this and be a man.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on November 27, 2014, 10:44:38 AM
Quote from: Big J on November 27, 2014, 10:39:56 AM
Quote from: RiverbumCO on November 25, 2014, 10:18:16 AM
I want a 44 mag lever.

http://www.vaguntrader.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/811421/gonew/1#UNREAD (http://www.vaguntrader.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/811421/gonew/1#UNREAD)

Forget lever action RBC, get this and be a man.

But seriously, here is an over priced .44 lever

http://www.vaguntrader.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/820156/gonew/1#UNREAD (http://www.vaguntrader.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/820156/gonew/1#UNREAD)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on November 27, 2014, 10:46:59 AM
Quote from: steelrain202 on November 27, 2014, 10:46:17 AM
I never understood a pistol caliber rifle.

Same ammo as side arm. Same mags as side arm too depending on carbine.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on November 27, 2014, 10:49:00 AM
And .357 mag and .44 mag rifles will take down any big game in the U.S. with ease.  The .357 mag. plenty for anything on east coast and .44 mag is great grizzly medicine out west.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on November 27, 2014, 10:58:46 AM
Quote from: steelrain202 on November 27, 2014, 10:52:37 AM
J I understand ballistics very well.


;D People like simplicity.  Nothing simpler than a same good cartridge for a pistol and rifle.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: flatlander on November 27, 2014, 11:01:26 AM
Ok gun nuts...my father-in-law bought a M4/AR15 (whatever they are called), and I have to admit, they're pretty fun to shoot at the range.  Make my heavy-barreled varmint rifles  seem pretty boring.  So if I were to buy one, what manufacturer?  I mean they're black, and they all look alike.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: flatlander on November 27, 2014, 11:09:16 AM
I don't know. Looking at Bud's Guns looks like the range seems to 650-1100 'ish.  Are Colts worth the premium over other manufacturers? 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: flatlander on November 27, 2014, 11:21:01 AM
Thanks.  I see all three at Buds.  The BCM's seem priced in line with Colt.  Daniels Defense is "Quote Only" so I assume they are even pricier.  They only seem to be offering components in the Spikes.  So what makes the BCM better than say a Colt?  Barrel? Tolerances?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: flatlander on November 27, 2014, 11:30:30 AM
Thanks.  I've heard people mention Daniels Defense before, but I never would have given BCM or Spikes a glance.  Happy Thanksgiving.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on December 17, 2014, 07:03:04 AM
Quote from: Shiite or Shinola on December 16, 2014, 18:52:26 PM
Justice for little Johnny! (http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/jurisprudence/2014/12/sandy_hook_lawsuit_parents_of_school_shooting_victims_sue_gun_manufacturer.html#lf_comment=249655471)

While I grieve for the parents of the Sandy Hook victims why should they or their lawyers get rich off the sale of something sold legally. If they want to change the law, which many have tried to do, they need to go through the legislative process. Yes, I know that would pit them against the NRA and that has not worked out very well. Like it or lump it that is how laws are made in this country. The NRA is not doing anything different than thousands of other lobbyist groups.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on December 17, 2014, 11:08:34 AM
Quote from: Al on December 17, 2014, 07:03:04 AM
Quote from: Shiite or Shinola on December 16, 2014, 18:52:26 PM
Justice for little Johnny! (http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/jurisprudence/2014/12/sandy_hook_lawsuit_parents_of_school_shooting_victims_sue_gun_manufacturer.html#lf_comment=249655471)

While I grieve for the parents of the Sandy Hook victims why should they or their lawyers get rich off the sale of something sold legally. If they want to change the law, which many have tried to do, they need to go through the legislative process. Yes, I know that would pit them against the NRA and that has not worked out very well. Like it or lump it that is how laws are made in this country. The NRA is not doing anything different than thousands of other lobbyist groups.

I suppose this lawsuit will test the 2005 federal law protecting gun companies.  Personally, it would be difficult for me to sue anyone, but the sorrow of these parents is foreign to me, so who knows for sure what we/I would do.   

"Get rich"?  What are they asking?

And Al, is the lawsuit not legal, just as it is legal to produce/sell these firearms?  How can you condemn U.S. citizens from exercising their legal right and then defend the legal right of getting rich manufacturing and selling firearms? 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on December 17, 2014, 11:54:46 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood on December 17, 2014, 11:08:34 AM
And Al, is the lawsuit not legal, just as it is legal to produce/sell these firearms?  How can you condemn U.S. citizens from exercising their legal right and then defend the legal right of getting rich manufacturing and selling firearms?

Actually the ones I am ranting against are the "ambulance chasing" lawyers. I am not condemning all lawyers, we all need them at times but there are some who smell $$$$ and go for it no matter what. Their motive has nothing to do with justice for the parents.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Beetle on December 17, 2014, 12:03:59 PM
Next time you meet a personal injury lawyer- ask them what kind of scanner they have in their office.   The reactions to that question are priceless.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on December 17, 2014, 16:25:08 PM
TF, way too many questions from you, queries with incorrect suppositions galore.   

First, no one is putting a price tag on children.

I have no idea of the reason for the lawsuit.

What would replace the hammer?  Again, don't have a clue.  I suppose I would buy stock in wood screws and screwdriving bits.

How often are criminals accommodating?  I know the answer to this one. ((Pi x Q)/2log(W))-69 % of the time

Lever actions, single shots, and double barrels exempt from what?  "You can say"?  Who said? Me, you, the President, the Pope, NRA?  What the hell are you talking about?  Are you fishing for opinions again?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: RiverbumCO on December 17, 2014, 16:57:23 PM
Ask him about mayflies.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on December 17, 2014, 17:20:11 PM
Quote from: troutfanatic on December 17, 2014, 16:45:07 PM

There is a perception amongst gun control advocates at large, that if we support so-called assault weapons bans, simple hunting weapons will be okay.


Yep, ask the folks in Great Britain and Australia how that "we just want registration, nothing else" stuff worked out
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(http://s3.photobucket.com/user/Allieworm/media/Allieworm021/1224_guns_standard_600x400_zps2d11ad50.jpg.html)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on December 17, 2014, 17:58:47 PM
Quote from: troutfanatic on December 17, 2014, 16:45:07 PM
By all means, offer an opinion. I have never tried to stop you before and you seem to have one on just about everything.

I do, but not about guns or control, feeble opinions at best.  I may have had strong opinions before, but I forgot them.  Yet to be knighted by Lord LaPierre is my price, because I don't stroke my weapons every evening.  If he ever dubs me worthy, my opinions on firearms might strengthen.  I do however have a view on paranoia (to be shared later). 

I know little about guns and less about gun control.  All I can do is wonder.   Have there been firearms banned in this country?  If so, what was the consequence?  Did it lead to the banning of other stuff?

You said you "refuse to be punished for the misdeeds of others".    I don't know if you could call it punishment, but I am fairly sure we are surrounded by laws and regulations of inconvenience that resulted from the ignorance, stupidity, and misdeeds of others. 

That is enough opinionating (word?) before supper.

RiverbumCO, mayflies rule!
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Onslow on December 19, 2014, 06:04:34 AM
 There was a mass stabbing that involved children in Franklin County NC back in the 80s.  Went down just a few miles from home.  Guns or no guns, the stabbings will continue
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: bullship on December 19, 2014, 09:14:42 AM
http://youtu.be/oQG54RRoTII
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on December 21, 2014, 14:56:23 PM
I bought my son a Remington 700 243 for his birthday in November. Nice scope and all.
He is out of the hospital again, bought a hunting license, and has been practicing on the range and dialing in the scope. He's heading out soon with some friends and wants to get his first deer.
I'm surprised because he is a total commie/socialist hippie, but he says that he now wants to kill and eat wild game. Healthy.
I told him to go for it. Heheh.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on June 26, 2015, 09:13:19 AM
Nothing is going to come from this shooting in regards to gun control. If Sandy Hook didn't make any drastic changes to gun control in US then this shooting isn't either.  A lot about the shooting bodes well for the argument for less gun control.  The nut shot up the church with a handgun, standard capacity and reloaded 3 times.  If there was one gun in that church, odds are that attack would of been stopped.  You might see another ammo run, but I do not predict any added control measures getting passed. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Grannyknot on June 26, 2015, 09:47:14 AM
lots of good points TF.  well said.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on June 26, 2015, 10:34:32 AM
Warning: Warped, personal BS opinion following.

Globally empower women and things will get better.  Give women honest equality and power over their reproductive potential and things will get better --- less greed, less warring, less killing, healthier environment, population check, more compassion, etc. 

Pipe dream?

Off to the mountains – peace peckerwoods.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: bmadd on June 26, 2015, 11:00:53 AM
Y'all had to go mess up a good thread didn't you. Was nice having a place we could just admire things that go bang
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on June 26, 2015, 11:16:34 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood on June 26, 2015, 10:34:32 AM
Warning: Warped, personal BS opinion following.

Globally empower women and things will get better.  Give women honest equality and power over their reproductive potential and things will get better --- less greed, less warring, less killing, healthier environment, population check, more compassion, etc. 

Pipe dream?

Off to the mountains – peace peckerwoods.

There is one flaw to your theory Mudwall, well one flaw that comes once a month. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Grannyknot on June 26, 2015, 11:39:10 AM
I just wanted to say that I'm sick of the post office employees being so unfriendly & also cinnamon spice instant oatmeal needs to be replaced by more maple brown sugar in the quaker variety boxes.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on June 26, 2015, 12:37:20 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood on June 26, 2015, 10:34:32 AM
Warning: Warped, personal BS opinion following.

Globally empower women and things will get better.  Give women honest equality and power over their reproductive potential and things will get better --- less greed, less warring, less killing, healthier environment, population check, more compassion, etc. 

Pipe dream?

Off to the mountains – peace peckerwoods.
Yup. This has been proven many times throughout history. When women's rights truly improve, so does the society.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: bmadd on June 26, 2015, 16:00:07 PM
Cereallessly, can we just keep this about guns and not everything else?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on June 26, 2015, 16:26:05 PM
Quote from: bmadd on June 26, 2015, 16:00:07 PM
Cereallessly, can we just keep this about guns and not everything else?

Cereal:  I was a little miffed at the last box of Kellogg's Raisin Bran Crunch I bought; there seemed to be less crunch.

Empowerment of the gals:  I just think it is a good idea (my opinion prejudiced by the late Hitchens).  I have no clue how to achieve such a fantasy.  If I did, I would not be looking at bugs.

Guns (things that go bang):  My wife is a better shot than I am.  You think that Heritage cowboy 22 mag 6-shooter will serve me against coyotes and panthers?  A supernovae explosion goes bang so they tell me; I am still waiting to hear the report.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: bmadd on June 26, 2015, 17:00:59 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood on June 26, 2015, 16:26:05 PM
Quote from: bmadd on June 26, 2015, 16:00:07 PM
Cereallessly, can we just keep this about guns and not everything else?

Cereal:  I was a little miffed at the last box of Kellogg's Raisin Bran Crunch I bought; there seemed to be less crunch.

Empowerment of the gals:  I just think it is a good idea (my opinion prejudiced by the late Hitchens).  I have no clue how to achieve such a fantasy.  If I did, I would not be looking at bugs.

Guns (things that go bang):  My wife is a better shot than I am.  You think that Heritage cowboy 22 mag 6-shooter will serve me against coyotes and panthers?  A supernovae explosion goes bang so they tell me; I am still waiting to hear the report.

Eat more fruits loops.

Same.

My wife is scared of guns no matter how much I try to mark her comfortable around them.

I think we should keep a thread just about guns, about guns. If you want to change course to gun rights or anything else, please start your own thread.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on June 26, 2015, 17:26:26 PM
Quote from: bmadd on June 26, 2015, 17:00:59 PM

I think we should keep a thread just about guns, about guns. If you want to change course to gun rights or anything else, please start your own thread.

Return to Go (page 1), reevaluate, and collect $100 of cowrie shells and whales teeth.  I started this thread, not that it makes a flip.  If you want to start a fresh thread on guns, Caitlyn Jenner, cool shower curtains, clever maternity shirts, or whatever, please charge ahead.  Or you can sidetrack this one into the abyss, or farther into the depths of BS.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on September 15, 2015, 12:01:57 PM
http://www.cnn.com/2015/08/27/opinions/us-guns-evidence/?iid=ob_article_footer_expansion&iref=obinsite (http://www.cnn.com/2015/08/27/opinions/us-guns-evidence/?iid=ob_article_footer_expansion&iref=obinsite)

Interesting.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on September 15, 2015, 12:07:40 PM
http://youtu.be/DKlpn8NzWGY (http://youtu.be/DKlpn8NzWGY)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: flatlander on September 15, 2015, 13:32:22 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood on September 15, 2015, 12:01:57 PM
http://www.cnn.com/2015/08/27/opinions/us-guns-evidence/?iid=ob_article_footer_expansion&iref=obinsite (http://www.cnn.com/2015/08/27/opinions/us-guns-evidence/?iid=ob_article_footer_expansion&iref=obinsite)

Interesting.

As usual, the comments are more interesting than the article itself.  The audacity of urban liberals never ceases to amaze me. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Yallerhammer on September 15, 2015, 13:43:58 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood on September 15, 2015, 12:01:57 PM
http://www.cnn.com/2015/08/27/opinions/us-guns-evidence/?iid=ob_article_footer_expansion&iref=obinsite (http://www.cnn.com/2015/08/27/opinions/us-guns-evidence/?iid=ob_article_footer_expansion&iref=obinsite)

Interesting.

I suggest that this guy not let the door hit him on the ass on his way out to go live in Europe in one of those wonderful, progressive liberal utopias where the government provides for all your needs, keeps the boogeymen away, tells you how to think and act, and keeps your balls locked up in a safe for you.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: themidge on November 06, 2015, 16:57:52 PM
Remington 700?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Yallerhammer on November 06, 2015, 18:39:26 PM
I like.  y;
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 06, 2015, 20:41:04 PM
Is that bolt gun a mossberg?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: bmadd on November 07, 2015, 16:22:32 PM
Looks good. What caliber?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Trout Maharishi on November 07, 2015, 19:34:16 PM
Looks like a good Coon gun ;D
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 07, 2015, 23:54:04 PM
Quote from: Trout Maharishi on November 07, 2015, 19:34:16 PM
Looks like a good Coon gun ;D
Pretty shitty troll attempt imo. I expect better trolls than this from you.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Trout Maharishi on November 08, 2015, 03:07:01 AM
No troll intended, wake up and smell the coffee. BTW, I've noticed it has become ever increasing less popular to speak your mind around here. Especially if it goes against the status quo. I do not call anyone names, imply they are simply trolling, question their intelligence, integrity, or honesty. I am a simple man and speak my mind. Disagreement is only natural when you have the diversity of personalities we have here. I am fine with agreeing to disagree.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on November 08, 2015, 09:42:20 AM
Very nice additions steel rain. About added a Sig P226 MK25 to my collection last week but held off. I have other things I need more then another handgun.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on November 08, 2015, 11:17:46 AM
Quote from: Trout Maharishi on November 08, 2015, 03:07:01 AM
No troll intended, wake up and smell the coffee. BTW, I've noticed it has become ever increasing less popular to speak your mind around here. Especially if it goes against the status quo. I do not call anyone names, imply they are simply trolling, question their intelligence, integrity, or honesty. I am a simple man and speak my mind. Disagreement is only natural when you have the diversity of personalities we have here. I am fine with agreeing to disagree.

Perhaps you did not speak your mind honestly; maybe you were vague, leading readers to interpret from less than complete information.      True unadulterated honesty is a rare thing, and even scarcer in a public forum. 

I am also fine with agreeing to disagree, but on what are we disagreeing?

Speaking of guns and the Winchester Ballistic Tip ammo, I finally found some for my 7mm-08.  I was down to a half dozen rounds.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on November 08, 2015, 11:22:10 AM
Reliable 30-06 for me. Upgraded to a Browning A-bolt with BOSS system (Fancy muzzle break) several years ago. It's probably accounted for 75 deer so far, including one last evening. I like the BOSS because it reduces recoil to .243 equivalent. Prior to that I had a Rem 760 pump in 30-06  which used to make my shoulder black and blue when I'd go to the range. 

Secret to any accurate rifle is a good trigger. Next secret is practice. This weekend I took several Wounded Warriors on a hunt. There was a range behind the club house. One fellow had not shot his rifle since last year - he put out a 10x12 sheet of paper, took one shot, at about 50 yards, which hit somewhere on the paper and declared "good enough".  No it is not!!!!!
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dee-Vo on November 08, 2015, 18:46:21 PM
"When raccoons tried getting on our back porch, Mama just chased them off with a broom. "
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dee-Vo on November 08, 2015, 21:10:33 PM
I've got many guns in the safe, and access to tons of calibers that I don't personally own. I have to admit that my favorite rifle is still my Winchester .243. Synthetic & stainless. I've shot everything under the sun with that little rifle for probably 20 years now. Flat shooting, a little easier on the wallet, and I've never had a problem with it doing the job I ask it to do as far as the kill. I usually stick with a Hornady 100 grain, but I've done fine with other manufacturers as well.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dee-Vo on November 08, 2015, 21:21:01 PM
I'll have to admit that when I've seen the entrance/exit holes from a .30/06 that I was envious. I've seen some where you could've easily fit a beer can in the exit hole. Impressive.

My dad used a .45/70 for a while. Interesting.

I'll add that I'm a fan of the lever guns. I like the classic 30/30, but love the .35 too.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 08, 2015, 21:22:49 PM
Big time .270 guy here. I think it is flatter than the /06.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dee-Vo on November 08, 2015, 21:41:38 PM
I wanted to shoot a deer with my .870 Express 12 gauge, using this ammo in 3 inch. I figured it would knock one down, but never got the opportunity. A dog that kept killing my chickens met the business end of those slugs though. They don't play.

http://reviews.cabelas.com/8815/210854/remington-premier-copper-solid-sabot-slugs-reviews/reviews.htm?page=4&sort=rating&dir=asc (http://reviews.cabelas.com/8815/210854/remington-premier-copper-solid-sabot-slugs-reviews/reviews.htm?page=4&sort=rating&dir=asc)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on November 08, 2015, 21:50:03 PM
270, 300 win mag, and 243. In that order for my favs
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: themidge on November 09, 2015, 06:45:59 AM
Quote from: troutfanatic on November 08, 2015, 18:38:00 PM
wait.

when we say "coon gun", you guys ain't referring to the 4-legged mammals that git in my trash cans are you?

The ole' Trash Panda.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dee-Vo on November 09, 2015, 07:22:52 AM
Another good caliber, the .280. Not nearly as popular, but a good rifle.

My family had one years back, and it was a tack driver. The only complaint was that it had some rattling on the interior in the workings somewhere, maybe due to it being an automatic.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Yallerhammer on November 09, 2015, 09:32:12 AM
You can't go wrong with an /06, .270, or .308. All great all-around calibers. I have a .300 Winmag that I like a lot, too; but it's a little overkill for deer. Built me a 7.62x39 AR for a 150-yard woods gun this year, pretty much a semi .30-30 ballistically.

Steelrain, I grew up coon and bear hunting with hounds, too, kept and raised redbones, blueticks, and Plotts for many years. Miss the hounds, don't have any these days.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on November 09, 2015, 14:45:12 PM
I grew up with the 30-06 because that is what I first used in the army (M1Garand) -  Lots of different ammo options and readily available world wide. If I were to purchase another rifle it would be in 308 for the same reasons.

I have never been a fan of the .223   It is too light for anything other then varmint hunting. They are making better ammo for it these days but it is still too light. It's OK if you make the perfect shot but most critters including man do not always offer the perfect shot.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on November 09, 2015, 16:42:19 PM
Quote from: Al on November 09, 2015, 14:45:12 PM
I grew up with the 30-06 because that is what I first used in the army (M1Garand) -  Lots of different ammo options and readily available world wide. If I were to purchase another rifle it would be in 308 for the same reasons.

I have never been a fan of the .223   It is too light for anything other then varmint hunting. They are making better ammo for it these days but it is still too light. It's OK if you make the perfect shot but most critters including man do not always offer the perfect shot.

Check out Alaska's Wolf Man: The 1915-55 Wilderness Adventures of Frank Glaser.  Glaser, a hired game hunter for road/rail builders and government, often used a .220 Swift.  Great book and obviously he was an excellent marksman. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Pansyman on November 09, 2015, 19:51:13 PM
The deer doesn't care what you kill it with -0-

I prefer my Ruger M-77 in .243 win. a shot to the neck and your tracking duties become very easy 'c;
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on November 09, 2015, 20:32:14 PM
You try shooting something that can shoot back and you want something that can anchor the sucker no matter where you hit him. "Spray and pray" or as SR put it, "shooting twice" is often not an option.

Another problem I saw with the .223 was when the other fellow had a 30 caliber he could pin you down at long range and you could not reach him with your pea shooter. I've heard SOF have experienced the same thing in our current war and some special units have been equipped with larger calibers.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Yallerhammer on November 10, 2015, 08:06:32 AM
TF, you ever see any of the .50 Beowulf ARs over there? Buddy of mine has one, said it was developed for check points and such to kill engine blocks. Good shooting, hard-hitting  rifle, probably similar to a hot-loaded .45/70 ballistics-wise.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: ptfranze on December 04, 2015, 11:28:29 AM
Maybe someone loves guns a little too much??

http://news.yahoo.com/man-hoard-nearly-5-000-guns-shows-ease-200547133.html?nf=1 (http://news.yahoo.com/man-hoard-nearly-5-000-guns-shows-ease-200547133.html?nf=1)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Yallerhammer on December 07, 2015, 13:35:56 PM
I'd worry a lot more more about the dude with one gun who shoots people than the dude with 5,000 guns who doesn't.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on December 07, 2015, 14:38:49 PM
This gun ownership thing is darned interesting.  Wrapping one's brain around what is going on in our country is difficult for me.  Honestly, I have no idea if more gun control is the remedy; perhaps control of certain types and capacities would decrease the carnage somewhat.  I believe most Americans are in favor of more control, and if this is indeed true, then it should be given its due.  What does concern me is organizations and industry controlling the situation and the agenda and the politicians.  Would getting rid of all firearms cure the problem?  No, not any more than shipping every Islamic citizen back across the water would solve terrorism on our soil.  Another entity would emerge.   

Worrying about who has a gun and how many they own has never crossed my mind.  Fearing one's own demise is a chicken-shit trait in my book.  Now, the security and wellbeing of family and loved ones is another story. 

Maybe we can learn from the bonobos.

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/bonobos-what-we-can-learn-from-our-primate-cousin/ (http://www.cbsnews.com/news/bonobos-what-we-can-learn-from-our-primate-cousin/)

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/sex-dawn/201202/7-things-bonobos-can-teach-us-about-love-and-sex (https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/sex-dawn/201202/7-things-bonobos-can-teach-us-about-love-and-sex)

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: driver on December 08, 2015, 20:27:31 PM
My cousin has a gun shop, and 2013 was his best year. Most sales coming in the months after Sandy Hook. He makes his best money when there are mass shootings.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Onslow on December 08, 2015, 20:39:10 PM
Irrational lunacy abounds.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dougfish on January 27, 2016, 08:38:20 AM
New shotgun shell :o

http://controversialtimes.com/issues/constitutional-rights/new-12-gauge-ammo-creates-holes-bigger-than-your-fist/ (http://controversialtimes.com/issues/constitutional-rights/new-12-gauge-ammo-creates-holes-bigger-than-your-fist/)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 27, 2016, 08:57:30 AM
That looks like it would hurt. 

Picked up a Winchester 94 in .357 magnum.  I may have get a deer this next season for some summer sausage.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: tomato can on January 27, 2016, 15:31:04 PM
dag gum, where did ya pick up that rifle?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 27, 2016, 15:48:54 PM
Quote from: tomato can on January 27, 2016, 15:31:04 PM
dag gum, where did ya pick up that rifle?

Finding a .357 mag Lever gun is like finding hen's teeth these days.  Especially a Winchester 94 in .357 mag.  You can find some Rossi's in .357, but they are garbage, and some Henry's, but I hate Henry's not having a loading gate in receiver.  Cowboy action shooters scoop up .357 mag lever guns quickly.  Found it in a shop in Roanoke.  Hardly shot if at even all. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on January 27, 2016, 20:32:49 PM
I know I will catch hell for this observation - Be sure to pick your shots Big J because a .357 is a little light for deer  (yes, I know, lots of deer shot with 22 rimfire but neither the 357 or the 22 would be my choice for a deer rifle)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 27, 2016, 20:59:47 PM
Quote from: Al on January 27, 2016, 20:32:49 PM
I know I will catch hell for this observation - Be sure to pick your shots Big J because a .357 is a little light for deer  (yes, I know, lots of deer shot with 22 rimfire but neither the 357 or the 22 would be my choice for a deer rifle)

Yes, I agree with you. you can get some pretty stout .357 hunting loads though. It would be a under 50 yards gun
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: tomato can on January 27, 2016, 21:09:58 PM
I would love to get my hands on a lightly used .44 mag lever action. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 27, 2016, 21:41:44 PM
Quote from: tomato can on January 27, 2016, 21:09:58 PM
I would love to get my hands on a lightly used .44 mag lever action.

Big Boy Guns in Blue Ridge had a Marlin JM stamped barrel in .44 mag last week. Might still have it.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: tomato can on January 28, 2016, 07:18:36 AM
Quote from: Big J on January 27, 2016, 21:41:44 PM
Quote from: tomato can on January 27, 2016, 21:09:58 PM
I would love to get my hands on a lightly used .44 mag lever action.

Big Boy Guns in Blue Ridge had a Marlin JM stamped barrel in .44 mag last week. Might still have it.

I have winnie tastes and marlin budged.  but before I do that I am still saving up for an al raft trailer.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: RiverbumCO on January 28, 2016, 21:29:56 PM
Picked up my .44 marlin today.  Gonna shoot it tomorrow, i bought the 50rd magtech ammo for $38.  Not terrible.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: JMiller on January 28, 2016, 21:48:54 PM
Ive got one of those in .35 rem.
A 1980, pre safety model. Love that gun.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dee-Vo on January 29, 2016, 02:03:46 AM
.35 Rem is sweet. I love the levers.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Yallerhammer on January 29, 2016, 07:58:50 AM
.35 Rem is an underrated caliber, IMO. Great woods gun for deer, hogs,  and bear.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 29, 2016, 09:10:09 AM
Quote from: RiverbumCO on January 28, 2016, 21:29:56 PM
Picked up my .44 marlin today.  Gonna shoot it tomorrow, i bought the 50rd magtech ammo for $38.  Not terrible.

Whenever you go to Wally World, look at the ammo.  There is a brand call Perfecta.  Fiocchi is supposedly the manufacturer.  I bought 50 rds of .357 mag for $18 which is way below the average price.  Great target ammo and all 100 rds feed perfectly thru my lever gun.  Sure the .44 mag is below average price as well.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on January 29, 2016, 09:24:44 AM
Quote from: Yallerhammer on January 29, 2016, 07:58:50 AM
.35 Rem is an underrated caliber, IMO. Great woods gun for deer, hogs,  and bear.

Phenomenal round.

Last deer I shot was with this round.

Directly head on, up the nasal cavity.  14" penetration with no exit.

Deer fell DRT - dead right there. 

Have shot for zero, but haven't shot anything with some of the Leverevolution ammo.  Know some folks reaching out beyond 200yds with excellent success.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: tomato can on January 29, 2016, 18:34:52 PM
Quote from: Big J on January 29, 2016, 09:10:09 AM
Quote from: RiverbumCO on January 28, 2016, 21:29:56 PM
Picked up my .44 marlin today.  Gonna shoot it tomorrow, i bought the 50rd magtech ammo for $38.  Not terrible.

Whenever you go to Wally World, look at the ammo.  There is a brand call Perfecta.  Fiocchi is supposedly the manufacturer.  I bought 50 rds of .357 mag for $18 which is way below the average price.  Great target ammo and all 100 rds feed perfectly thru my lever gun.  Sure the .44 mag is below average price as well.

You can get boxes of .38 special from www.slickguns.com (http://www.slickguns.com) for 14 bucks a box.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: RiverbumCO on January 30, 2016, 00:45:46 AM
I bought 50 rds of magtech for $38 w/o reading this.  Oh well, just wanted to blast some off.  I shot 20 today beside my .25-06.  Trigger work and stock mods on the .25 paid off, thumbnail sized group with 4 shots from 50 yds, which is an improvement for the cheap-o Axis rifle.   

The lever gun is awesome.  It didnt group great, but thats with shitty ammo and a scope that im 99% sure isnt adjusting the crosshairs when i adjust them.  Looking to upgrade with either a 1.5-5x20 leupold vx-3 or 1.25x4-20 vx-r firedot reticle.  With some premium hunting ammo i think i can group 3 shots in an inch at 50.

The .44 had much less recoil than the .25, which surprised me.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Yallerhammer on January 30, 2016, 09:16:31 AM
The .44 mag is a pistol round. It doesn't have nearly as much powder in it as the .25-06, which is just a necked-down .30-06. The .44 is stout for a pistol round, but is weak compared to most rifle rounds. Still plenty enough for deer at reasonable ranges, though.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on January 30, 2016, 15:32:01 PM
Quote from: Yallerhammer on January 30, 2016, 09:16:31 AM
The .44 mag is a pistol round. It doesn't have nearly as much powder in it as the .25-06, which is just a necked-down .30-06. The .44 is stout for a pistol round, but is weak compared to most rifle rounds. Still plenty enough for deer at reasonable ranges, though.
I am sure he is aware of this information, as is everyone else otb
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Yallerhammer on January 30, 2016, 15:46:14 PM
Probably so. I was not trying to be a smartass, just commenting on his statement that he was surprised that the .44 had a lot less recoil than the .25/06.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 30, 2016, 17:09:52 PM
Quote from: wildmttrout on January 30, 2016, 15:32:01 PM
Quote from: Yallerhammer on January 30, 2016, 09:16:31 AM
The .44 mag is a pistol round. It doesn't have nearly as much powder in it as the .25-06, which is just a necked-down .30-06. The .44 is stout for a pistol round, but is weak compared to most rifle rounds. Still plenty enough for deer at reasonable ranges, though.
I am sure he is aware of this information, as is everyone else otb

I personally never overestimate Erik's intelligence.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: RiverbumCO on January 31, 2016, 00:27:10 AM
So kind in your old age.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: RiverbumCO on January 31, 2016, 00:33:09 AM
But really, looking like with Hornady xtps i can be 2 high at 50, dead at 100 and 3-4 low at 150.  Not that im shooting 150 with it.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: natureboy on January 31, 2016, 01:06:35 AM
Guests are not allowed to view images in posts, please Register or Login


I added one to the stable a few weeks ago, pawnshop deal, itching to break a few clays with it.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: RiverbumCO on January 31, 2016, 09:53:55 AM
I need me an automatic.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 31, 2016, 10:05:36 AM
http://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/news/2016/01/29/facebook-cracks-down-on-gun-sales/79543652/ (http://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/news/2016/01/29/facebook-cracks-down-on-gun-sales/79543652/)

Congrats FB for being a puppet.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 31, 2016, 10:12:21 AM
Quote from: RiverbumCO on January 31, 2016, 00:33:09 AM
But really, looking like with Hornady xtps i can be 2 high at 50, dead at 100 and 3-4 low at 150.  Not that im shooting 150 with it.

Are the leverevolution ammo from Hornady any good on .357 and .44? My limited understanding is it was made to made some of the pointed cartridges more safe loading in Lever guns. Any accuracy gained from the point on flat nose cartridges?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Onslow on January 31, 2016, 11:25:45 AM
Quote from: Big J on January 31, 2016, 10:05:36 AM
http://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/news/2016/01/29/facebook-cracks-down-on-gun-sales/79543652/ (http://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/news/2016/01/29/facebook-cracks-down-on-gun-sales/79543652/)

Congrats FB for being a puppet.

Intelligent move on their part to minimize lawsuit risk, imo.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: RiverbumCO on January 31, 2016, 13:15:01 PM
Quote from: Big J on January 31, 2016, 10:12:21 AM
Quote from: RiverbumCO on January 31, 2016, 00:33:09 AM
But really, looking like with Hornady xtps i can be 2 high at 50, dead at 100 and 3-4 low at 150.  Not that im shooting 150 with it.

Are the leverevolution ammo from Hornady any good on .357 and .44? My limited understanding is it was made to made some of the pointed cartridges more safe loading in Lever guns. Any accuracy gained from the point on flat nose cartridges?

Probably not accuracy, i think they were designed to extend the range of those chamberings.  Kinda defeats the purpose imo.  I wont use it, the bullets fragment and blow up too quickly.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on March 12, 2016, 19:02:23 PM
Put a couple hundred rounds thru the Winchester 94. Action on the 94 has been a little gunky so disassembly, a little sanding, and cleaning was due. Fun gun to take apart and reassemble

Guests are not allowed to view images in posts, please Register or Login
(http://s103.photobucket.com/user/BigJSV2/media/65F55956-7C37-4F62-8C94-1AFF5031709A_zpsvxrnin4t.jpg.html)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on March 25, 2016, 19:06:30 PM
My thumb/wrist is keeping me from doing anything useful so I have been surfing the net a bit. Here is one that refutes a lot of what the anti's would have us gun nuts believe

https://www.youtube.com/embed/pELwCqz2JfE?rel=0&autoplay=true (https://www.youtube.com/embed/pELwCqz2JfE?rel=0&autoplay=true)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Pansyman on April 14, 2016, 18:47:22 PM
Scary shit scenario here.
http://www.ammoland.com/2016/04/illinois-lethal-violence-order-of-protection-act-gun-confiscation/?utm_campaign=shareaholic&utm_medium=facebook&utm_source=socialnetwork#axzz45ljcRF5A (http://www.ammoland.com/2016/04/illinois-lethal-violence-order-of-protection-act-gun-confiscation/?utm_campaign=shareaholic&utm_medium=facebook&utm_source=socialnetwork#axzz45ljcRF5A)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Yallerhammer on April 14, 2016, 18:50:24 PM
My son is currently residing in Illinois. He hates it, and so does his wife, who is a Texas gal. Uncle Sam decrees that they live there, though.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Da Heisenberg on April 14, 2016, 19:08:31 PM
IL is gonna burn. Them bad cops killed a poor innocent 16 y/o hood rat for the mere offense of pointing a gun at a cop.

Black Lives Matter is in full effect. You know the group right? That's those people of African ancestry getting their strings pulled by a former SS guy, old white, billionaire, hedge fund manager and patron saint of the Clintons.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on May 30, 2017, 10:17:02 AM


Only took 10 months to get this. More fun than Uncle Sam wants us Red Blooded Americans to have.

http://youtu.be/jcGRS6_j06Y


Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: hcrum87hc on May 31, 2017, 11:38:32 AM
Quote from: Big J on May 30, 2017, 10:17:02 AM


Only took 10 months to get this. More fun than Uncle Sam wants us Red Blooded Americans to have.

http://youtu.be/jcGRS6_j06Y



The image/video is blocked here at work, but based on the 10 months comment, I'm assuming it's a suppressor or other NFA item.  Good stuff if so.  I have a SilencerCo Omega on my .300blk SBR.  Subsonics are a lot of fun with that set up.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on May 31, 2017, 12:29:36 PM
Quote from: hcrum87hc on May 31, 2017, 11:38:32 AM


The image/video is blocked here at work, but based on the 10 months comment, I'm assuming it's a suppressor or other NFA item.  Good stuff if so.  I have a SilencerCo Omega on my .300blk SBR.  Subsonics are a lot of fun with that set up.

Correct. It's a .22 suppressor so it's very quiet. Heard good things about .300blk suppressed. Heck a supressor company designed that cartridge.  Good luck on that wait, it's painful waiting that long. Once the wait times go back down I think I'll pick up a 30 cal can.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on May 31, 2017, 13:15:42 PM
BigJ, squirrel sniper

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Grannyknot on May 31, 2017, 13:48:36 PM
Big J, i wasn't paying close enough attention to the video to notice what you were shooting and i thought it was one of those high powered pellet rifles.
Thats 100% bad ass.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: hcrum87hc on June 01, 2017, 06:34:08 AM
Quote from: Big J on May 31, 2017, 12:29:36 PM
Quote from: hcrum87hc on May 31, 2017, 11:38:32 AM


The image/video is blocked here at work, but based on the 10 months comment, I'm assuming it's a suppressor or other NFA item.  Good stuff if so.  I have a SilencerCo Omega on my .300blk SBR.  Subsonics are a lot of fun with that set up.

Correct. It's a .22 suppressor so it's very quiet. Heard good things about .300blk suppressed. Heck a supressor company designed that cartridge.  Good luck on that wait, it's painful waiting that long. Once the wait times go back down I think I'll pick up a 30 cal can.

I think I waited about 8 months on mine, but that was a couple of years ago.  With subs, my .300blk sounds somewhere between a .22lr and a pellet rifle.  With supers, it sounds about like an unsuppressed .22lr.  I'd like to pick up a .22lr and a 9mm or .45 suppressor as well to round out my collection.  I'm waiting to see what happens with upcoming legislation before I make the leap.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on June 01, 2017, 08:00:22 AM
Quote from: hcrum87hc on June 01, 2017, 06:34:08 AM



I think I waited about 8 months on mine, but that was a couple of years ago.  With subs, my .300blk sounds somewhere between a .22lr and a pellet rifle.  With supers, it sounds about like an unsuppressed .22lr.  I'd like to pick up a .22lr and a 9mm or .45 suppressor as well to round out my collection.  I'm waiting to see what happens with upcoming legislation before I make the leap.

For some reason I thought you said you ordered it and was waiting on it still.  I filed my tax stamp thru a trust before they changed the filing process for NFA trust back in July last year.  Wait times early 2016 got down to 3 to 4 months. Rumor has it that once the ATF catches up on the June/July suppressor buys, the wait times will be back down to 3 to 4 months or shorter.  No one is buying suppressors right now because they are waiting for that hearing protection act to pass.  I don't think the bill will make it to the floor this year from everything I've read.  Here is an article on Silencer Shop mailing out $2 million worth of NFA stamps in a day back when there was a big push before the regislation change on NFA trust.

http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2016/07/13/silencer-shop-sends-2m-worth-of-nfa-stamp-applications/ (http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2016/07/13/silencer-shop-sends-2m-worth-of-nfa-stamp-applications/)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: troutfanatic on June 01, 2017, 08:51:22 AM
better to make them yourself and not have government paper trail.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: hcrum87hc on June 02, 2017, 09:27:48 AM
Quote from: Big J on June 01, 2017, 08:00:22 AM
For some reason I thought you said you ordered it and was waiting on it still.  I filed my tax stamp thru a trust before they changed the filing process for NFA trust back in July last year.  Wait times early 2016 got down to 3 to 4 months. Rumor has it that once the ATF catches up on the June/July suppressor buys, the wait times will be back down to 3 to 4 months or shorter.  No one is buying suppressors right now because they are waiting for that hearing protection act to pass.  I don't think the bill will make it to the floor this year from everything I've read.  Here is an article on Silencer Shop mailing out $2 million worth of NFA stamps in a day back when there was a big push before the regislation change on NFA trust.

http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2016/07/13/silencer-shop-sends-2m-worth-of-nfa-stamp-applications/ (http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2016/07/13/silencer-shop-sends-2m-worth-of-nfa-stamp-applications/)

Yeah, my SBR only took a few months to get approved, but I did it as a form 1 and "built" up the lower instead of buying a full rifle.  The addition of a transfer from the dealer to the purchaser of a suppressor adds a couple months.  I don't suspect the HPA will pass any time soon, but even if it takes a few years, I can wait.  I have a trust, which I had created before all the changes, but man it'd be a drag having to get fingerprints done for all of my trustees.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: troutfanatic on June 02, 2017, 10:48:51 AM
I am hearing there is a bill up in NC that will allow permitless concealed carry. I'm not sure how I feel about that.

http://wncn.com/2017/06/01/nc-bill-would-allow-concealed-guns-without-permit-in-nc/
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: sanjuanwormhatch on June 02, 2017, 11:31:34 AM
That's a horrible idea.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on June 02, 2017, 11:43:15 AM
Quote from: troutfanatic on June 02, 2017, 10:48:51 AM
I am hearing there is a bill up in NC that will allow permitless concealed carry. I'm not sure how I feel about that.

http://wncn.com/2017/06/01/nc-bill-would-allow-concealed-guns-without-permit-in-nc/

I can see both sides to argument.  They call it Constitutional Carry.  Premise behind it is to reduce the number of people open carrying.  A lot of law enforcement officers are complaining about the number of calls they have to investigate from people calling in to report someone open carrying. If they have a gun and can open carry it, what harm will it be to conceal carry it.  People illegally concealing a gun anyways are still going to conceal a gun if law passes.  I do not think you will see a rise in any crime or deaths if this gets passed.  People open carrying guns aren't the ones typically committing crimes, therefore allowing them to conceal carry isn't going to change that.  I like the gun safety course in high school idea too.  On the flip side though, people should really just get their concealed carry permit and be done with it..
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: troutfanatic on June 02, 2017, 13:28:05 PM
I like the idea of a background check and required training. The current policy requires both. I am not an advocate of open carry because it inspires panic and too many people do it as a provocative statement. However, I must admit I have open carried before, but not in Walmart while buying milk, more like West Virginia while fishing the methamphetamine heartland.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Onslow on June 02, 2017, 20:22:00 PM
In this era wherein government is blamed for the public's shortcomings, churches attendance is plummeting, public education is being starved out of existence, political polarization seems to be at an all time high, organizations that have facilitated all manner of civic goodness are fading, it makes perfect sense to make guns more accessible.  May I suggest we all respond to our latent grievances, and just start killing each other.  I think this will make us all feel better about our state of affairs. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dougfish on June 02, 2017, 20:23:48 PM
Here, here! Locked and loaded.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Yallerhammer on June 03, 2017, 14:18:21 PM
Permitless carry is a bad idea? Really? What part of "shall not be infringed" is unclear? Maybe we should have to get a permit to speak freely or practice religion? Freedom is really scary sometimes to those of a liberal bent who don't understand it or want it. I have carried a gun every day of my life for many, many years; and I have never shot anybody. Why do liberals assume that "access to guns" (which is guaranteed by our constitution,) equals everybody shooting each other? Actually, if you look at the statistics, shootings and murders are much more common in the places in the country with the strictest gun control laws, and not nearly as prevalent in places with less restricted access to firearms. People are just so out of touch with reality these days that it is really scary, and they want the government to protect, feed, clothe, and doctor them from the cradle to the grave. No thanks.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Onslow on June 03, 2017, 19:54:32 PM
These?

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-34996604
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: JMiller on June 04, 2017, 05:44:58 AM
I'll stay away from the constitutional argument, but just from an LE perspective, I'm definitely not a fan of permitless carry.

Is it a pain to check and run somebody when I have to? Sure. But for the most part the permit simplifies things.
It is reassuring to know that a guy with a permit for a weapon has a relatively clean history, has taken the time to take the class and do the paperwork, which alone says something about the caliber of person you're dealing with.
And IMO, the permit process and legal ramifications of carrying without a permit keep every wannabe badass from donning weapons as fashion accessories (like the pit bull on the logging chain) which is only going to lead to trouble, and more work for me.

That said, idiots are still going to cause trouble and shoot each other regardless of what the laws are.

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Onslow on June 04, 2017, 05:53:04 AM
Couple points

1.  Our rights to bear arms have been infringed upon for quite some time.  The public is not allowed to manufacture or possess bombs, weaponized biological agents, grenades, stinger missiles, patriot missiles, heavy artillery.

2.  Don't think SJWH needs any monetary help from Uncle Sam, and neither do i.  Not down with the labels either.

3.  Regarding regulation, employees, employers, LLCs, LLPs, type S, etc, are all expected to fill out paperwork, businesses must register with the Secretary of State, and in some cases, lawyers are needed just to start a damned business.  Anyone not motivated enough to jump a few hoops probably doesn't need or deserve a concealed privileges.

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Yallerhammer on June 04, 2017, 07:32:52 AM
I have had a concealed carry permit for a long time. I jumped through the hoops because I had to. If permitless carry becomes law, I will continue to renew it, because of the reciprocity with other states that I regularly travel to and through.

As I said, freedom can be scary for some. But, I bet you would be shocked to know how many of the folks you pass in the grocery store, restaurant, or other places you travel, have a gun concealed on them. Those are not the folks you need to worry about. In fact, they may save your life some day. People who commit crimes with guns should be dealt with harshly. As for infringement, keep in mind that when the 2nd was written, the average citizen was as well or better armed than the average soldier. As written, civilians could legally own anything that the military had. The main intent of the 2nd is to have a populace that is capable of resisting governmental tyranny should it arise.

As for the gun violence statistics, two things are never pointed out by those who quote them. One is that a very big percentage of these gun crimes are committed by convicted felons who already cannot legally own a gun. Another is that the majority of this gun violence happens in the same places-mostly inner cities with strict gun control laws. And much of it is gang and drug related, committed, again, by those who can't legally own guns. More gun laws do not help in reality. And so far, about 100% of mass shootings occur in "gun-free" zones where it is illegal for anyone to have a firearm. I wonder why?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: sanjuanwormhatch on June 05, 2017, 10:13:56 AM
Quote from: Yallerhammer on June 04, 2017, 07:32:52 AM
I have had a concealed carry permit for a long time. I jumped through the hoops because I had to. If permitless carry becomes law, I will continue to renew it, because of the reciprocity with other states that I regularly travel to and through.

As I said, freedom can be scary for some. But, I bet you would be shocked to know how many of the folks you pass in the grocery store, restaurant, or other places you travel, have a gun concealed on them. Those are not the folks you need to worry about. In fact, they may save your life some day. People who commit crimes with guns should be dealt with harshly. As for infringement, keep in mind that when the 2nd was written, the average citizen was as well or better armed than the average soldier. As written, civilians could legally own anything that the military had. The main intent of the 2nd is to have a populace that is capable of resisting governmental tyranny should it arise.

As for the gun violence statistics, two things are never pointed out by those who quote them. One is that a very big percentage of these gun crimes are committed by convicted felons who already cannot legally own a gun. Another is that the majority of this gun violence happens in the same places-mostly inner cities with strict gun control laws. And much of it is gang and drug related, committed, again, by those who can't legally own guns. More gun laws do not help in reality. And so far, about 100% of mass shootings occur in "gun-free" zones where it is illegal for anyone to have a firearm. I wonder why?

I personally don't like concealed weapons and have never ever even felt close to needing one.  I have a wife, two young children and another one on the way.
I have decent things.  I travel to "inner city" areas frequently.  I deal with people who have criminal records frequently.  And I promise you I live in a place with more crime than just about anyone in this discussion.  Never.  Not once have I considered taking a gun with me when I leave my home.

That being said there is a 2nd Amendment and I think there's room for people to carry guns.  Period.  But this argument that it cannot even be regulated is inconsistent with centuries of constitutional law.  Constitutional rights can be regulated for various reasons.  Can the regulation become so stifling such that it's considered an infringement?  Abso-fucking-lutely.  Does requiring a background check for people to carry fall in that category?  No.

But a few point by points:

1.  I'm glad you'll continue to renew your license even though you won't have to.  Not everyone will though.

2.  "The people we need to worry about" will be able to lawfully carry under this law correct?  The reason I don't have to worry about you is because you've been through background checks.

3.  In 1791, it was legal for humans to enslave other humans.  It bothers me when people cite certain constitutional theories for one particular right without looking at whether or not they should apply to other rights given to us in the constitution.  Long short, what was happening at the time of the drafting is one of many numerous considerations.




Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on June 05, 2017, 16:51:16 PM
I have a permit and now own a few pistols.  Honestly, I am ashamed that I have the permit.  BUT, I developed a yellow, chicken shit streak because of coyotes and bears.  I've never carried around the public, only when hunting, fishing, hiking, or camping.  I've seen some hairy two-legged critters in Wal-Mart, but never any 4 legged.  There in lays my fear, now resulting in carrying a pistol in the woods.

Peace, you gun loving peckerwoods!!!
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Yallerhammer on June 05, 2017, 18:16:01 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on June 05, 2017, 16:51:16 PM
I have a permit and now own a few pistols.  Honestly, I am ashamed that I have the permit.  BUT, I developed a yellow, chicken shit streak because of coyotes and bears.  I've never carried around the public, only when hunting, fishing, hiking, or camping.  I've seen some hairy two-legged critters in Wal-Mart, but never any 4 legged.  There in lays my fear, now resulting in carrying a pistol in the woods.

Peace, you gun loving peckerwoods!!!
Coyotes and bears don't worry me at all. It's the other bipeds without feathers that I don't trust. :D
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: troutfanatic on June 05, 2017, 20:29:09 PM
I have faith in humans, until narcotics or methamphetamine comes into play. I'd like a nice coyote pelt, but haven't the time to do one up. Bears are harmless, throw them a sandwich.

I think open carry is an obnoxious statement that drives fear and would rather see it go away. It is one thing for someone to carry a 9mm handgun into a business, it is another thing altogether for these clowns that want to patrol Walmart with an M4 or AK.

Not much will convince me otherwise. I support concealed carry, but it needs to be controlled. I like NC's current policy of graduating from a certification course and having a background check. I realize criminals will carry regardless, but some will think twice. Consider parole violations and back to the can for example. I have seen people do some downright stupid shit while carrying a firearm. I used to hang out with a guy who claimed to be a handgun expert, yet I found internet postings where he admitted he had no clue how to disassemble his own pistol.

A law like this will have costs higher than benefit.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Yallerhammer on June 06, 2017, 05:10:44 AM
I totally agree on the "look at me!" open carry crowd. I have a pretty epic arsenal of scary-looking weapons, but I have no desire to tote it around through Walmart so that I can look like a badass in my own mind and impress and frighten people. Open carry out in rural Yancey County is one thing, but in Trader Joe's in the middle of Asheville, it's a quite different thing. Those folks do nothing but hurt and restrict our 2nd Amendment rights by acting like idiots. And their actions often result in the "no weapons" signs going up on business doors. Personally, I would rather no one know that I have a gun on me unless I am involved in a life-or-death situation. Open carry makes you a target.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on June 06, 2017, 08:09:33 AM
Quote from: Yallerhammer on June 05, 2017, 18:16:01 PM

Coyotes and bears don't worry me at all. It's the other bipeds without feathers that I don't trust. :D

Out where Mudwall is, is about 1 of 3 locations in VA I'd be concerned with bear.  State use (might still) to relocate a lot of trouble bears out that way to get them away from towns and populations.  Other location bear concern me in VA is SNP.  Too many human interactions with those bears and they just are not afraid of humans like they use to be and view them as a source of carrying food. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: hcrum87hc on June 06, 2017, 08:54:16 AM
Yaller, when it comes to guns and gun rights, I think you and I are kindred spirits.  I don't really have an issue with constitutional carry one way or the other.  Like you, I much prefer to carry concealed, and will continue to do so by renewing my SC CWP permit.  I carry everywhere I legally can, and pray that I never have to use it, but bad things can happen at any time, and in any place.  It's my responsibility to protect my family, and I will do so if the need arises. 

It's baffling to me why these mouth breathers carry their AR-15s and other rifles around town and into businesses.  They're just going for shock factor and I guess trying to make a point, but all they're doing is hurting our cause.  I do believe everyone has the right to own firearms, including ARs and AKs, but I don't think everyone should.   Some people are just too dumb for their own (and our) good.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: sanjuanwormhatch on June 06, 2017, 09:05:29 AM
But are you okay with permitless carry?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: hcrum87hc on June 06, 2017, 12:10:41 PM
Quote from: sanjuanwormhatch on June 06, 2017, 09:05:29 AM
But are you okay with permitless carry?

I'm pretty indifferent to it, to be honest.  I wouldn't likely take advantage of it, personally.  I'm not fully aware of the laws in other states, but the proposed constitutional carry law in SC would require one to open carry if they did not have a CWP.  We don't currently have open carry in SC unless fishing or hunting. 

Would it bother me?  No.  People who are already illegally carrying concealed will continue to do so.  Why would they open carry and give away their surprise factor and draw attention to themselves?  Felons aren't allowed to own guns, by law.  They're already breaking the law by having one, so why would they advertise it by open carrying per the constitutional carry law (which would be illegal anyways, as the law wouldn't apply to someone who cannot legally own a gun)?  I don't see it changing things except allowing those that wish to open carry legally do so.





Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on December 19, 2017, 19:19:02 PM


Since there isn't much fishing on her lately........

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New to me rifle. Ruger American Predator in 6.5 Creedmoor. Been wanting to try out some long range shooting with this caliber.

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: ryguy on December 19, 2017, 19:57:44 PM
Nice rifle!  How long is long range? 


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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on December 19, 2017, 20:02:58 PM
Quote from: ryguy on December 19, 2017, 19:57:44 PM
Nice rifle!  How long is long range? 


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Hitting at 1,000 yards is my goal. Need to get a nicer optic for the rifle though.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on December 19, 2017, 20:06:21 PM
http://youtu.be/blcfloZYuig

Same model rifle at a range I hope to visit in Virginia soon.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: ryguy on December 19, 2017, 22:04:31 PM
That would be fun!  I competed with an M16 out to 400m open sights, takes some getting used to.  That range was a 1000yd range but we didn't have anything to shoot that far (and expect to hit a target).


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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on December 20, 2017, 10:14:48 AM
Quote from: Big J on December 19, 2017, 19:19:02 PM


Since there isn't much fishing on her lately........

New to me rifle. Ruger American Predator in 6.5 Creedmoor. Been wanting to try out some long range shooting with this caliber.


You fell for the "fashion cartridge" of the last few years, and joined the 6.5 love fest.

Now go see Scott up at quail ridge in Lexington and get him to show you how to shoot long range.  He knows his stuff.


https://www.quailridgesportingclub.com/copy-of-3d-archery

http://www.blueridgenow.com/article/NC/20050516/News/606075532/HT/
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on December 20, 2017, 10:44:10 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on December 20, 2017, 10:14:48 AM



You fell for the "fashion cartridge" of the last few years, and joined the 6.5 love fest.

Now go see Scott up at quail ridge in Lexington and get him to show you how to shoot long range.  He knows his stuff.


https://www.quailridgesportingclub.com/copy-of-3d-archery

http://www.blueridgenow.com/article/NC/20050516/News/606075532/HT/

I know absolutely nothing about long distance shooting.  I plan on taking a course with bangsteel in Wytheville.  I had interest a few years back but lost it. Scott (Consumnfire) reignited my interest. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: streamereater_101691 on December 20, 2017, 15:55:10 PM
6.5 creedmoor is a good round that packs good muzzle velocity and trajectory

300 win mag and .308(7.62) are more suited for long range IMO..more power,heavier bullet, less spin and wind drift..etc..

1000yds ins't out of the question with good optics/steady rest/good mechanics..emphasis on all three of those

IMO, its a awesome coyote gun because of the near 300 win mag velocities it will spit out
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dougfish on December 20, 2017, 17:50:26 PM
Guess I need to get the old .308 Win cleaned up. Bang, bang.  -0-
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: driver on December 20, 2017, 18:09:20 PM
I used to work at a 1000yd range. Most everyone shot .308 and .243 with .243 being the majority. But that was 20+ years ago.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: ryguy on December 20, 2017, 18:25:11 PM
Looked at the website for Bang Steel.  Looks like a really fun class.  I'd need a scope upgrade...


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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on December 20, 2017, 19:10:46 PM
.300 winmag is a hell of a round. Witnessed my dad stone a nice buck at over 500yds a couple of years ago with a winmag.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: NCsporksman on December 20, 2017, 22:59:20 PM
Shot a 6.5 suppressed rig at Uwharrie the other day, it was le tits

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on December 21, 2017, 11:21:41 AM
Quote from: NCsporksman on December 20, 2017, 22:59:20 PM
Shot a 6.5 suppressed rig at Uwharrie the other day, it was le tits

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The 6.5 suppressed sounds fun.  Bet it takes a lot of the bark out of it.

I think a lot of the Competition guys are using 6mm sized rounds these days.  .308 can hit at 1,000, but drops a lot more than the new 6mm rounds from what I've read.  Also read that 6.5 handles wind better than the .308.  If I was deer hunting though, I think I'd go .308 all the way.  This is all from research and not experience though.  But it was found on the internet, so it has to be true.

  .300 win mag and .388 lapua are good long rang options as well, but be prepared for more kick. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on December 21, 2017, 12:34:48 PM
I am not a great shot, and I am not convinced any school/training and/or rifle/caliber would make me a great long range shooter.    I believe there are some innate qualities to great long range shots.

I've witnessed some unbelievable long shots for these neck-of-the-woods.  I saw a 300 yd + shot with a lever action .25-35 Winchester.  Relatives were some of the first to hunt from trees around here.   They built permanent stands from pressure treated lumber on NF (no longer legal) on north facing slopes and shot over deep hollows at very long distances to the south facing hills.  They froze their asses off, being in the shade so much, BUT they made some unbelievable shots with a .308 – even practiced before season by painting and shooting rocks on the south hills and watching with good glass to see if they were accurate.   

I am a believer in inherent talent/skill over caliber or equipment. 

We (family) have too many 7mm-08s to think of something new.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dougfish on December 21, 2017, 14:08:06 PM
The greatest shot I ever witnessed was my Grandfather dropping a running deer at 105 yds. with a 12 ga. slug. Brother has that Browning today.  bd;0
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: driver on December 21, 2017, 15:57:14 PM
As for local deer hunting. .270 for long range, or 30-30 for in the woods.

30-30s are a highly underrated gun.


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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on December 21, 2017, 17:04:34 PM
Quote from: driver on December 21, 2017, 15:57:14 PM
As for local deer hunting. .270 for long range, or 30-30 for in the woods.

30-30s are a highly underrated gun.


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So is the .270. I would take it over just about any caliber out there (sans .300win)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: streamereater_101691 on December 21, 2017, 18:59:02 PM
Good shooting mechanics rule caliber every time. I'm of the old school opinion of buying a weapon to fill multiple purposes. Target shooting is fine at 250-1000yds, but I like to have the opportunity to hunt the same rifle as well. Having a rifle that'll reach that far(accurately) requires a lot of time put in with many rounds sent down range.

I shot the new ruger precision in 6.5mm last week and I still would revert back to my remington 700 .300 win mag just because I've had so much time behind it. Theres a reason chris kyle selected the cartridge as well ;D
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on December 21, 2017, 19:16:16 PM
I've never shot the 6.5, so cannot comment on it. Had a lot of military experience with the 7.62 X 51, which is pretty much the same as a 308. Also shot a 308 civilian gun some. Gets the job done. The 300 mag has a little more bang, but is also similar.  For shooting at something other than targets....
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: NCsporksman on December 21, 2017, 22:43:45 PM
I'm late to the gun game, one week of squirrel hunting has taught me I also suck at it...also that a $100 .22 semi-auto long rifle is the funnest fucking thing I've bought in years...10/10

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Grannyknot on December 22, 2017, 08:24:10 AM
Quote from: NCsporksman on December 21, 2017, 22:43:45 PM
I'm late to the gun game, one week of squirrel hunting has taught me I also suck at it...also that a $100 .22 semi-auto long rifle is the funnest fucking thing I've bought in years...10/10

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They are so damn fun.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on December 22, 2017, 10:13:32 AM
Perusing this gun thread, 'Show off your steel thread', and the 'Beer,BBQ, and music', I don't believe we've improved one damned bit, as men.  Adoration of weapons and charring meat remains popular with many of us, the knuckle-dragging Cro-Magnons. 

JMiller and Beetle can kiss my holiday ass for being sexist and tiresome!

Happy holidays.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on December 22, 2017, 10:37:17 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on December 22, 2017, 10:13:32 AM
Adoration of weapons and charring meat remains popular with many of us, the knuckle-dragging Cro-Magnons. 



And stupid. You forgot stupid. Now I'm going to go punch holes with lead thru paper.

Knuckle dragger out.

Merry Christmas.

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Onslow on December 23, 2017, 08:20:02 AM
Quote from: NCsporksman on December 21, 2017, 22:43:45 PM
I'm late to the gun game, one week of squirrel hunting has taught me I also suck at it...also that a $100 .22 semi-auto long rifle is the funnest fucking thing I've bought in years...10/10

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Ambling about in the Uwharries for a few days with a backpack & 22, shooting, and eating tree rats with rice with no schedule sounds like a great way to leave this miserable world behind.  I've gotta make this happen.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: NCsporksman on December 23, 2017, 10:29:14 AM
Quote from: Onslow on December 23, 2017, 08:20:02 AM
Quote from: NCsporksman on December 21, 2017, 22:43:45 PM
I'm late to the gun game, one week of squirrel hunting has taught me I also suck at it...also that a $100 .22 semi-auto long rifle is the funnest fucking thing I've bought in years...10/10

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Ambling about in the Uwharries for a few days with a backpack & 22, shooting, and eating tree rats with rice with no schedule sounds like a great way to leave this miserable world behind.  I've gotta make this happen.
That's exactly what I've been doing all week, headed there this afternoon

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on December 23, 2017, 14:20:40 PM
Here is something to consider if you are of the mindset that you're going to exercise your right to open carry :o

http://www.fayobserver.com/news/20171222/stolen-gun-at-walmart-causes-panic
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: JMiller on December 24, 2017, 08:57:22 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on December 22, 2017, 10:13:32 AM
Perusing this gun thread, 'Show off your steel thread', and the 'Beer,BBQ, and music', I don't believe we've improved one damned bit, as men.  Adoration of weapons and charring meat remains popular with many of us, the knuckle-dragging Cro-Magnons. 

JMiller and Beetle can kiss my holiday ass for being sexist and tiresome!

Happy holidays.

How is it possible to improve upon such things?
Adoring theatre with our wives and charring hummus?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on December 24, 2017, 09:09:58 AM
Quote from: JMiller on December 24, 2017, 08:57:22 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on December 22, 2017, 10:13:32 AM
Perusing this gun thread, 'Show off your steel thread', and the 'Beer,BBQ, and music', I don't believe we've improved one damned bit, as men.  Adoration of weapons and charring meat remains popular with many of us, the knuckle-dragging Cro-Magnons. 

JMiller and Beetle can kiss my holiday ass for being sexist and tiresome!

Happy holidays.

How is it possible to improve upon such things?
Adoring theatre with our wives and charring hummus?

Great response!  I commend and applaud.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: bmadd on December 26, 2017, 10:04:42 AM
Speaking of .22s, anyone own a Ruger Mark II?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on December 26, 2017, 13:11:26 PM
Quote from: bmadd on December 26, 2017, 10:04:42 AM
Speaking of .22s, anyone own a Ruger Mark II?
Dad has the target grade mark ii. Pretty badass iiwba.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: troutfanatic on January 08, 2018, 20:01:25 PM
Had one as a kid. I'm betting Al was familiar with them in the Army 8)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Yallerhammer on January 10, 2018, 07:58:42 AM
Quote from: bmadd on December 26, 2017, 10:04:42 AM
Speaking of .22s, anyone own a Ruger Mark II?

I have owned one in the past. I currently have  Mark III 22/45 bull barrel that is a fine little accurate pistol. Love it. Any of the Ruger Marks are great pistols.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 10, 2018, 08:54:36 AM
Get a Mark IV.  The disassembly alone is reason enough too. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on January 10, 2018, 09:07:35 AM
Quote from: Big J on January 10, 2018, 08:54:36 AM
Get a Mark IV.  The disassembly alone is reason enough too.

Truth.

I have a Standard (now sometimes referred to as a Mark I) and a Mark III.

The IV is sweet.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: bmadd on January 10, 2018, 23:27:18 PM
I can get the Mark II ridiculously cheap and brand new. Still thinking on it at least just to shoot empty beer cans with.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 11, 2018, 09:01:28 AM
Where can you get a Mark II brand new? Gun hasn't been produced in over 10 years.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: bmadd on January 11, 2018, 11:30:08 AM
BNIB that has been locked in a gun safe for approximately 15 years. Still covered in packing grease.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 11, 2018, 13:15:50 PM
Quote from: bmadd on January 11, 2018, 11:30:08 AM
BNIB that has been locked in a gun safe for approximately 15 years. Still covered in packing grease.

Dang, I'd buy it for the right price. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: troutfanatic on January 11, 2018, 14:56:28 PM
I'll thread it for the right price.

Yous guys missed all the guns I sold last fall.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: ryguy on January 11, 2018, 19:43:37 PM
Anyone looking at the new Sig P365?


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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 11, 2018, 20:19:18 PM
Quote from: ryguy on January 11, 2018, 19:43:37 PM
Anyone looking at the new Sig P365?


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As soon as the hype and prices go back down after the release, I'll get one. Same size as a SW Shield but holds 4 more rounds with the flush mag!
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: ryguy on January 11, 2018, 21:02:02 PM
Yeah they look great.  I have an XD-S and might consider trading it in..


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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: hcrum87hc on January 12, 2018, 10:51:35 AM
I'll be selling my M1 Walther PPS to purchase the new Sig.  The Sig is a little shorter, lighter, and has the same width and height with 3 more rounds and night sights come standard.  As long as it's proved to be reliable, I'll be picking one up for sure.  The price is nice too on the few preorders I've seen.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 28, 2018, 17:40:28 PM



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Got into the 1911 game. 1983 Colt 1911 Series 80.

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 28, 2018, 18:10:55 PM
Gun, guns, guns, everyone loves guns!

I just ordered one of these in a 20 gauge last week.

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on January 28, 2018, 19:31:58 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 28, 2018, 18:10:55 PM
Gun, guns, guns, everyone loves guns!

I just ordered one of these in a 20 gauge last week.
Dafaq is that
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on January 28, 2018, 20:41:08 PM
Thinking about one of these - figure it will be good for keeping the riff/raff in line.

https://www.gunsamerica.com/blog/non-nfa-14-shotgun-mossberg-shockwave-12-ga-full-review/

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: ryguy on January 28, 2018, 20:44:04 PM
Nice Colt 1911.  I have one that we got after deployment.  They are an awesome pistol, much sturdier than the M9...


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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 29, 2018, 07:33:58 AM
Quote from: ryguy on January 28, 2018, 20:44:04 PM
Nice Colt 1911.  I have one that we got after deployment.  They are an awesome pistol, much sturdier than the M9...


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Military will have Sig P320's soon. Makes more sense for military to have a light polymer side arm.

I'll be curious how this 1911 runs. Heard these Colts can be ammo picky.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on January 29, 2018, 07:51:29 AM
Quote from: Big J on January 29, 2018, 07:33:58 AM


I'll be curious how this 1911 runs. Heard these Colts can be ammo picky.

If you get the chance, find a Series 70

However, there are some great tips & tricks on making 1911's run consistently and smoothly.

What are your plans for it?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 29, 2018, 08:45:42 AM
I'm not real sure it needs much.  Has a Chandler Arms Recoilmaster guide rod and spring, Wilson Combat trigger, Wilson Combat backstrap and hammer.  Bet the trigger is a 2 lb pull.  You barely touch the trigger and it breaks.  Kind of scary, but it'll be just a range gun.  Has original box, paperwork, and all the original parts that were replaced.  Going to run some hollow points thru it to just see how well it feeds and if it has some ammo preferences.  From my limited reading, JHP, seem to be disliked by these 1911's.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on January 29, 2018, 10:06:50 AM
Quote from: Big J on January 29, 2018, 08:45:42 AM
I'm not real sure it needs much.  Has a Chandler Arms Recoilmaster guide rod and spring, Wilson Combat trigger, Wilson Combat backstrap and hammer.  Bet the trigger is a 2 lb pull.  You barely touch the trigger and it breaks.  Kind of scary, but it'll be just a range gun.  Has original box, paperwork, and all the original parts that were replaced.  Going to run some hollow points thru it to just see how well it feeds and if it has some ammo preferences.  From my limited reading, JHP, seem to be disliked by these 1911's.

Look for a square bottom firing pin stop.  That will allow you to fine tune your recoil.

I'm not certain Wilson makes a square FPS for a Series 80, but EGW does:  http://www.egwguns.com/firing-pin-stops/

Just don't take a dremel to the the feed ramp.  Leave that part of the timing to a pro.
Raymond

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: ryguy on January 29, 2018, 10:22:35 AM
Mine has some hammer bite on occasion.
I'm happy about the P320, it's a nice pistol and I am looking forward to shooting it.


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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 29, 2018, 13:29:55 PM
Quote from: rbphoto on January 29, 2018, 10:06:50 AM

Look for a square bottom firing pin stop.  That will allow you to fine tune your recoil.

I'm not certain Wilson makes a square FPS for a Series 80, but EGW does:  http://www.egwguns.com/firing-pin-stops/

Just don't take a dremel to the the feed ramp.  Leave that part of the timing to a pro.
Raymond

May be a dumb question, but how does the FPS correlate to recoil management?

And doubt I'd ever use a dremel to the feed ramp, but know taking a scotch brite pad to the feed ramp to polish it will help it feed a little better.  Just need to put some rounds thru it and see if it needs it.  Gun doesn't appear to have been shot much and still a tight gun.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on January 29, 2018, 15:27:59 PM
Quote from: Big J on January 29, 2018, 13:29:55 PM
Quote from: rbphoto on January 29, 2018, 10:06:50 AM

Look for a square bottom firing pin stop.  That will allow you to fine tune your recoil.

I'm not certain Wilson makes a square FPS for a Series 80, but EGW does:  http://www.egwguns.com/firing-pin-stops/

Just don't take a dremel to the the feed ramp.  Leave that part of the timing to a pro.
Raymond

Lots of reasons.

1.  Reduces extractor movement
2.  Browning's original design was modified for speed, not reliability.
3. oh, just read these:

http://rangehot.com/reduced-radius-firing-pin-stop-1911/

http://www.dlsports.com/locking_1911_firing_pin_stop.html

http://oldglorygunsmith.blogspot.com/2014/09/issues-concerning-m1911-firing-pin-stop.html

Raymond



May be a dumb question, but how does the FPS correlate to recoil management?

And doubt I'd ever use a dremel to the feed ramp, but know taking a scotch brite pad to the feed ramp to polish it will help it feed a little better.  Just need to put some rounds thru it and see if it needs it.  Gun doesn't appear to have been shot much and still a tight gun.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 29, 2018, 15:50:53 PM
Well thanks for the links, I learned a lot.  I'll check mine when I get back. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: JMiller on February 08, 2018, 10:45:20 AM
My new T/C Encore Pro Hunter single shot 20 gauge. Added the scope, but I've never had one on a shotty before.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Grannyknot on February 08, 2018, 11:19:25 AM
Quote from: JMiller on February 08, 2018, 10:45:20 AM
My new T/C Encore Pro Hunter single shot 20 gauge. Added the scope, but I've never had one on a shotty before.

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thats cool.  i'm in the market for a 20ga right now.
although not quite at the t/c price point  :embarassed:
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: JMiller on February 08, 2018, 11:42:53 AM
So yea, a lot of turkey hunters especially are moving to 20s now because the factory loads available are so good, there's no reason to beat the shit out of yourself with 3.5" 12 gauge mag loads.

Lot of guys are just using 870 youth models, and maybe adding a pistol grip to them. They work great, don't cost a lot at all.

Personally, Ive been wanting a single shot  because my eldest son is 6 now, and can participate in the youth hunts. I typically hunt break actions anyway and want him to get in the habit of using guns and being safe.  These dont weigh a lot, and dont produce hardly any recoil, so it should be a good fit.

Plus I have the option of getting other barrels, so there's that.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on February 08, 2018, 12:32:35 PM
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Figure with the boards trend lately, I should bring this to your attention.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: driver on February 08, 2018, 12:32:59 PM
I've always laughed at duck hunters that tell me the shoot 3.5s

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Native Fisher on February 08, 2018, 13:21:31 PM
The biggest stomp I ever got from a shotgun was shooting 3" buckshot loads in a very lightweight 20 gauge double.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: sanjuanwormhatch on February 08, 2018, 14:48:04 PM
I'm not an expert on guns but I have an 870 12ga for turkeys and have been happy with it.  It's a beast but it's also a few hundred bucks. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Grannyknot on February 08, 2018, 14:58:01 PM
Quote from: JMiller on February 08, 2018, 11:42:53 AM
So yea, a lot of turkey hunters especially are moving to 20s now because the factory loads available are so good, there's no reason to beat the shit out of yourself with 3.5" 12 gauge mag loads.

Lot of guys are just using 870 youth models, and maybe adding a pistol grip to them. They work great, don't cost a lot at all.

Personally, Ive been wanting a single shot  because my eldest son is 6 now, and can participate in the youth hunts. I typically hunt break actions anyway and want him to get in the habit of using guns and being safe.  These dont weigh a lot, and dont produce hardly any recoil, so it should be a good fit.

Plus I have the option of getting other barrels, so there's that.

I don't turkey hunt, but recently traded one of my old guns for an 870 12ga.
I've only shot clays with it so far, but it seems pretty heavy for walking around in the woods, which i'd like to start doing again.
My son is almost 7, so i'm considering an 870 20ga, maybe compact, for my walkabout gun that can eventually be his first gun.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: sanjuanwormhatch on February 08, 2018, 15:50:40 PM
Quote from: Grannyknot on February 08, 2018, 14:58:01 PM
Quote from: JMiller on February 08, 2018, 11:42:53 AM
So yea, a lot of turkey hunters especially are moving to 20s now because the factory loads available are so good, there's no reason to beat the shit out of yourself with 3.5" 12 gauge mag loads.

Lot of guys are just using 870 youth models, and maybe adding a pistol grip to them. They work great, don't cost a lot at all.

Personally, Ive been wanting a single shot  because my eldest son is 6 now, and can participate in the youth hunts. I typically hunt break actions anyway and want him to get in the habit of using guns and being safe.  These dont weigh a lot, and dont produce hardly any recoil, so it should be a good fit.

Plus I have the option of getting other barrels, so there's that.

I don't turkey hunt, but recently traded one of my old guns for an 870 12ga.
I've only shot clays with it so far, but it seems pretty heavy for walking around in the woods, which i'd like to start doing again.
My son is almost 7, so i'm considering an 870 20ga, maybe compact, for my walkabout gun that can eventually be his first gun.

there's an upland version of the 870.  I don't know exactly what that means but one trait I would want out of a gun marketed specifically for upland hunting is that it's lighter. 

Again, far from an expert. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dougfish on February 08, 2018, 17:34:17 PM
If you know Grannyknot, everything is heavy to him.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: ryguy on February 08, 2018, 19:57:19 PM
Quote from: sanjuanwormhatch on February 08, 2018, 15:50:40 PM
Quote from: Grannyknot on February 08, 2018, 14:58:01 PM
Quote from: JMiller on February 08, 2018, 11:42:53 AM
So yea, a lot of turkey hunters especially are moving to 20s now because the factory loads available are so good, there's no reason to beat the shit out of yourself with 3.5" 12 gauge mag loads.

Lot of guys are just using 870 youth models, and maybe adding a pistol grip to them. They work great, don't cost a lot at all.

Personally, Ive been wanting a single shot  because my eldest son is 6 now, and can participate in the youth hunts. I typically hunt break actions anyway and want him to get in the habit of using guns and being safe.  These dont weigh a lot, and dont produce hardly any recoil, so it should be a good fit.

Plus I have the option of getting other barrels, so there's that.

I don't turkey hunt, but recently traded one of my old guns for an 870 12ga.
I've only shot clays with it so far, but it seems pretty heavy for walking around in the woods, which i'd like to start doing again.
My son is almost 7, so i'm considering an 870 20ga, maybe compact, for my walkabout gun that can eventually be his first gun.

there's an upland version of the 870.  I don't know exactly what that means but one trait I would want out of a gun marketed specifically for upland hunting is that it's lighter. 

Again, far from an expert.

870 Wingmaster includes an upgraded wood stock over the standard laminate one.  It also includes a finer finished barrel and receiver, over the standard version.  They are great shotguns regardless of the configuration.  I have an old Stevens 311 20 gauge, and it too is a great American made gun, easily found on the used market.


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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on February 08, 2018, 20:09:47 PM
Quote from: Dougfish on February 08, 2018, 17:34:17 PM
If you know Grannyknot, everything is heavy.

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Underrated post
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Grannyknot on February 09, 2018, 08:09:00 AM
Quote from: Dougfish on February 08, 2018, 17:34:17 PM
If you know Grannyknot, everything is heavy to him.

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UNCALLED FOR   n!n
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: sanjuanwormhatch on February 09, 2018, 10:39:20 AM
Quote from: ryguy on February 08, 2018, 19:57:19 PM
Quote from: sanjuanwormhatch on February 08, 2018, 15:50:40 PM
Quote from: Grannyknot on February 08, 2018, 14:58:01 PM
Quote from: JMiller on February 08, 2018, 11:42:53 AM
So yea, a lot of turkey hunters especially are moving to 20s now because the factory loads available are so good, there's no reason to beat the shit out of yourself with 3.5" 12 gauge mag loads.

Lot of guys are just using 870 youth models, and maybe adding a pistol grip to them. They work great, don't cost a lot at all.

Personally, Ive been wanting a single shot  because my eldest son is 6 now, and can participate in the youth hunts. I typically hunt break actions anyway and want him to get in the habit of using guns and being safe.  These dont weigh a lot, and dont produce hardly any recoil, so it should be a good fit.

Plus I have the option of getting other barrels, so there's that.

I don't turkey hunt, but recently traded one of my old guns for an 870 12ga.
I've only shot clays with it so far, but it seems pretty heavy for walking around in the woods, which i'd like to start doing again.
My son is almost 7, so i'm considering an 870 20ga, maybe compact, for my walkabout gun that can eventually be his first gun.

there's an upland version of the 870.  I don't know exactly what that means but one trait I would want out of a gun marketed specifically for upland hunting is that it's lighter. 

Again, far from an expert.

870 Wingmaster includes an upgraded wood stock over the standard laminate one.  It also includes a finer finished barrel and receiver, over the standard version.  They are great shotguns regardless of the configuration.  I have an old Stevens 311 20 gauge, and it too is a great American made gun, easily found on the used market.


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yeah that's what i was going for.  i want to get one of those at some point.  my son is 5 so he's got a little ways but might be his first gun.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: JMiller on February 09, 2018, 11:14:05 AM
Just my opinion, but if you're taking/teaching kids, I would advise a break action gun.

Doesn't have to be some $2,000 bejeweled masterpiece, even a NEF Pardner single, or some of the new Turkish O/Us are excellent quality. ATI, CZ, etc. Nice and light.
No barrel plugs come dove season, no fumbling to get all the shells out the mag tube. 

Very easy to tell if it's loaded and ready to shoot. If not actively hunting, everyone stands around with actions OPEN, everyone can see everyone is safe.

Nothing against pumps at all I own one, but you can't be too safe.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on February 09, 2018, 11:40:23 AM
Quote from: JMiller on February 09, 2018, 11:14:05 AM
Just my opinion, but if you're taking/teaching kids, I would advise a break action gun.

Doesn't have to be some $2,000 bejeweled masterpiece, even a NEF Pardner single, or some of the new Turkish O/Us are excellent quality. ATI, CZ, etc. Nice and light.
No barrel plugs come dove season, no fumbling to get all the shells out the mag tube. 

Very easy to tell if it's loaded and ready to shoot. If not actively hunting, everyone stands around with actions OPEN, everyone can see everyone is safe.

Nothing against pumps at all I own one, but you can't be too safe.

^^ I heartily agree.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on February 09, 2018, 13:34:55 PM
Quote from: Phil on February 09, 2018, 11:40:23 AM
Quote from: JMiller on February 09, 2018, 11:14:05 AM
Just my opinion, but if you're taking/teaching kids, I would advise a break action gun.

Doesn't have to be some $2,000 bejeweled masterpiece, even a NEF Pardner single, or some of the new Turkish O/Us are excellent quality. ATI, CZ, etc. Nice and light.
No barrel plugs come dove season, no fumbling to get all the shells out the mag tube. 

Very easy to tell if it's loaded and ready to shoot. If not actively hunting, everyone stands around with actions OPEN, everyone can see everyone is safe.

Nothing against pumps at all I own one, but you can't be too safe.

^^ I heartily agree.

As do I, but I also heartily stress covering a safety briefing with new shooters and all young people. 

I coach a youth shotgun team and safety is the first thing we cover every time before we touch the guns.  Get to the point they volunteer to cover the safety information and can do it from start to finish and then I start to have some confidence they might not shoot anyone when they get excited.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: sanjuanwormhatch on February 09, 2018, 14:02:03 PM
all good points.  break action gun it is.

speaking of recently heard someone raving (relatively) about yildiz for their price.   crowd sourced reviews are about as reliable as a wet fart but I did find it interesting they pretty consistently got good reviews.  $399 for the 20. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Grannyknot on February 09, 2018, 14:10:08 PM
Quote from: JMiller on February 09, 2018, 11:14:05 AM
Just my opinion, but if you're taking/teaching kids, I would advise a break action gun.

Doesn't have to be some $2,000 bejeweled masterpiece, even a NEF Pardner single, or some of the new Turkish O/Us are excellent quality. ATI, CZ, etc. Nice and light.
No barrel plugs come dove season, no fumbling to get all the shells out the mag tube. 

Very easy to tell if it's loaded and ready to shoot. If not actively hunting, everyone stands around with actions OPEN, everyone can see everyone is safe.

Nothing against pumps at all I own one, but you can't be too safe.

good info, thanks.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on February 09, 2018, 14:25:01 PM
Quote from: sanjuanwormhatch on February 09, 2018, 14:02:03 PM
all good points.  break action gun it is.

speaking of recently heard someone raving (relatively) about yildiz for their price.   crowd sourced reviews are about as reliable as a wet fart but I did find it interesting they pretty consistently got good reviews.  $399 for the 20.

Q/A is spotty on them, from what I have seen.

Semi's struggle to function properly; bolt closers are super stiff; O/U's barrels do not always have the same Point of Impact (POI), firing pin issues, etc.  They are also aluminum receivers, which means they are great for most field use but do not count on them being multi-generational guns.  Buy them, shoot them 'til the kid outgrows them, sell them and buy something more durable.

Raymond
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on February 09, 2018, 15:32:44 PM
Quote from: sanjuanwormhatch on February 09, 2018, 14:02:03 PM
all good points.  break action gun it is.

speaking of recently heard someone raving (relatively) about yildiz for their price.   crowd sourced reviews are about as reliable as a wet fart but I did find it interesting they pretty consistently got good reviews.  $399 for the 20.
Not sure if they are still available or how much, but I have a Baikal izh-27 20ga that is the tits for around $500. Light and throws up well. Was my grouse gun when grouse still existed.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: tomato can on February 10, 2018, 07:47:14 AM
If your buying a shotgun you should check out some used guns.  There are some nice Ithaca 37's out there for a decent price.   You can find good Uggies, AyA etc for decent prices also if you are into double barrel stuff.  I can carry my 16 gage Ithaca all day in the grouse woods and really that is all I do is carry the dang thing.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Yallerhammer on February 10, 2018, 08:13:45 AM
I think it's hard to beat the Stevens in the cheaper O/U shotguns.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: bmadd on February 10, 2018, 08:44:33 AM
Quote from: driver on February 08, 2018, 12:32:59 PM
I've always laughed at duck hunters that tell me the shoot 3.5s

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My cousin in law that hunts with me is a die hard 3.5 BB shooter. He cannot be talked out of it either. I tried a couple years back and now I just SMH.


I don't do any woods walking, but I still love my 870 20 gauge. I got the youth version for my first gun. About 5 years ago I bought a 26" barrel and a full size synthetic stock for it. It's a very natural pointer for me and I still use it a lot for Dove and early wood duck\teal season. If duck shells weren't more expensive than 12, I would probably use it for everything.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Pansyman on February 11, 2018, 07:12:38 AM
Quote from: JMiller on February 09, 2018, 11:14:05 AM
Just my opinion, but if you're taking/teaching kids, I would advise a break action gun.

Doesn't have to be some $2,000 bejeweled masterpiece, even a NEF Pardner single, or some of the new Turkish O/Us are excellent quality. ATI, CZ, etc. Nice and light.
No barrel plugs come dove season, no fumbling to get all the shells out the mag tube. 

Very easy to tell if it's loaded and ready to shoot. If not actively hunting, everyone stands around with actions OPEN, everyone can see everyone is safe.

Nothing against pumps at all I own one, but you can't be too safe.


You're correct Sir IMHO.  I learned to dove hunt, rabbit hunt with one, broke open while walking,,,,,,,,,,,safety is first.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on February 11, 2018, 16:41:56 PM
I gave this 1920's Iver Johnson 20 to my son. It was my father's, then my first gun and I took care of it. Dave learned to gunsmith, restored it completely, and uses it.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: greg on February 11, 2018, 20:45:25 PM
That's a sweet 20 there. Reminds me of my grandfathers 410 I have.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Yallerhammer on February 13, 2018, 08:19:37 AM
Quote from: Phil on February 11, 2018, 16:41:56 PM
I gave this 1920's Iver Johnson 20 to my son. It was my father's, then my first gun and I took care of it. Dave learned to gunsmith, restored it completely, and uses it.



I've got an old Iver Johnson 16 gauge that belonged to my great-grandpa. It's the semi-hammerless model with the ring in the trigger guard to break it down, made sometime between 1900 and 1908..
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on February 13, 2018, 12:08:35 PM
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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on April 02, 2018, 08:29:43 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 28, 2018, 18:10:55 PM
Gun, guns, guns, everyone loves guns!

I just ordered one of these in a 20 gauge last week.


I just patterned this turkey gun with 3 different loads.  All 3 loads patterned the same- -high and to the left.  The back beaded rail sight was adjustable left and right, so the windage was corrected.  Trouble is the rear sight is as low as it will go, so adjusting elevation is not.  I could raise the front beaded sight with some work, but the question I have is: --- could I simply not take such a fine front bead and align with more of the front bead (and post) visible, essentially raising the front sight?

Does this make sense to any of you gun gurus or am I off base?  Thanks. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on April 02, 2018, 08:49:01 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on April 02, 2018, 08:29:43 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 28, 2018, 18:10:55 PM
Gun, guns, guns, everyone loves guns!

I just ordered one of these in a 20 gauge last week.


I just patterned this turkey gun with 3 different loads.  All 3 loads patterned the same- -high and to the left.  The back beaded rail sight was adjustable left and right, so the windage was corrected.  Trouble is the rear sight is as low as it will go, so adjusting elevation is not.  I could raise the front beaded sight with some work, but the question I have is: --- could I simply not take such a fine front bead and align with more of the front bead (and post) visible, essentially raising the front sight?

Does this make sense to any of you gun gurus or am I off base?  Thanks.

How high is the gun shooting?  If it wasn't by much, I'd just use Kentucky Windage.  You sure your putting the front sight high enough in the rear notch sight picture?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on April 02, 2018, 08:52:24 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on April 02, 2018, 08:29:43 AM

I just patterned this turkey gun with 3 different loads.  All 3 loads patterned the same- -high and to the left.  The back beaded rail sight was adjustable left and right, so the windage was corrected.  Trouble is the rear sight is as low as it will go, so adjusting elevation is not.  I could raise the front beaded sight with some work, but the question I have is: --- could I simply not take such a fine front bead and align with more of the front bead (and post) visible, essentially raising the front sight?

Does this make sense to any of you gun gurus or am I off base?  Thanks.

Definitely a head scratcher b'; but it makes about as much sense as some of your other thought provoking posts ;D
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on April 02, 2018, 09:54:34 AM
Quote from: Big J on April 02, 2018, 08:49:01 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on April 02, 2018, 08:29:43 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 28, 2018, 18:10:55 PM
Gun, guns, guns, everyone loves guns!

I just ordered one of these in a 20 gauge last week.


I just patterned this turkey gun with 3 different loads.  All 3 loads patterned the same- -high and to the left.  The back beaded rail sight was adjustable left and right, so the windage was corrected.  Trouble is the rear sight is as low as it will go, so adjusting elevation is not.  I could raise the front beaded sight with some work, but the question I have is: --- could I simply not take such a fine front bead and align with more of the front bead (and post) visible, essentially raising the front sight?

Does this make sense to any of you gun gurus or am I off base?  Thanks.

How high is the gun shooting?  If it wasn't by much, I'd just use Kentucky Windage.  You sure your putting the front sight high enough in the rear notch sight picture?

About 10" high.  KY windage is for left and right, correct?

I am putting front bead deep in rear sight, so I can see nothing but bead.  That is my point/question.  If I align front sight higher (bead higher and some of its post exposed) will that work? Now the 2 beads of the rear and the front bead are even horizontally -- if I stack the front bead on top of the 2 rear -- like a 3 log pyramid will that lower the impact pattern? 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on April 02, 2018, 10:04:30 AM
Kentucky Windage can be for direction, it's just knowing POI of a gun and holding off target slightly so POI is on target.  But 10" high on a new gun, I'd send it back to manufacturer.  No reason a gun should leave factory that off.  Other option would be just to buy new sights and install them yourself, especially if your not crazy in love with the current set up.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Beetle on April 02, 2018, 10:58:21 AM
I agree with Jacob.   Unless you have dominant eye issues, it's the gun and I would send it back.

Sincerely,
Over and Under Only
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on April 16, 2018, 14:34:27 PM
From a brief mention of it someone made a few months ago -- has anybody here bought the Sig 365? Thoughts/opinions? Is it really superior to the G26 in concealability or more comparable to the G26 Gen5?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on April 16, 2018, 15:05:08 PM
Quote from: Phil on April 16, 2018, 14:34:27 PM
From a brief mention of it someone made a few months ago -- has anybody here bought the Sig 365? Thoughts/opinions? Is it really superior to the G26 in concealability or more comparable to the G26 Gen5?

I've fondled one at the gun shop that was waiting on its owner to pick up.  Think S&W Shield or Glock 43 size.  Big difference is the fact they kept it at 1" width but fitting 10 and 12 rounds.  S&W Shield is .95" and holds 7 and 8 rounds.  You get semi double stack mag but staying in single stack size category.  Glock 26 is 1.18" width.  While .18 of an inch doesn't seem like a whole lot, it makes a big difference if you are going to IWB carry.  I've tried IWB carrying a double stack gun, and just isn't comfortable to me.  When I had a Shield, I didn't even feel it. I'll be picking up a P365 soon.  They seem to have already fixed the bugs in the first batch of them.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on April 16, 2018, 15:12:37 PM
" I've tried IWB carrying a double stack gun, and just isn't comfortable to me."
I hear you there.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: ryguy on April 16, 2018, 15:21:27 PM
I have yet to see one they are in such high demand.  Got a buddy who pre ordered at Brownells, no estimates on ship dates.

All that said, if it is as good as they claim, I will strongly consider getting one.


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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on April 16, 2018, 15:24:37 PM
There was a guy trying to sell one for $700 firm.  MSRP is $599 and gun shop prices have been $500-$550 when they do pop up.  I messaged the guy asking if he knew that MSRP was $599 and if for $700 it came with any extras.  He didn't react too kindly to me. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on April 16, 2018, 15:26:40 PM
My G27 is just too thick and heavy for true EDC. Been thinking about a G43.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on April 16, 2018, 15:43:51 PM
Quote from: Phil on April 16, 2018, 15:26:40 PM
My G27 is just too thick and heavy for true EDC. Been thinking about a G43.

Cannot go wrong with a S&W Shield or a G43.  Both time proven.  I personally liked the Shield a little more (hence why I bought one) just solely off of the extra round in flush and extended mags.  Ended up selling the Shield for an LCP II for extra concealment.  I'll get the P365 to fill the single stack 9 role though and put some rounds thru it.

Whatever you decide Phil, you can't go wrong between the three.  It'll be a whole lot more comfortable than the G27 too.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on April 16, 2018, 15:55:12 PM
.380 isn't enough stoppage....
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Yallerhammer on April 17, 2018, 11:32:27 AM
Quote from: Phil on April 16, 2018, 15:26:40 PM
My G27 is just too thick and heavy for true EDC. Been thinking about a G43.

I carry a G23 every day, even in shorts and tshirt. Never had a problem. I have a little LC9 too that I like to carry, but it just doesn't hold enough munitions to suit me.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Yallerhammer on April 17, 2018, 11:33:45 AM
Quote from: Phil on April 16, 2018, 15:55:12 PM
.380 isn't enough stoppage....

Agreed. Did you see the video awhile back where the two women shot the robber multiple times with a .380 and a .38?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on April 17, 2018, 12:48:31 PM
While I do agree you lose a lot going below 9mm, .380 has it's niche.  The thing .380 has going for it these days is advancements in ammo and size of the guns.  Bigger guns and more rounds are nice, if you can carry it.  Easier to pass on carrying for the day a double stack 15 round gun than it is a gun you can just slip in your pocket.  Also nice for situations where you do not want to print but want to have something.  The Lehigh .380 xtreme penetrators aren't a bad little .380 round. 

James Bong carried a .32 acp. 


Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dougfish on April 17, 2018, 17:58:54 PM
Quote from: Big J on April 17, 2018, 12:48:31 PM
James Bong carried a .32 acp.

James bong was a bag guge.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on April 17, 2018, 18:44:34 PM
Ohhhh, Henheheh. I was waiting....    'c;    y;
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on April 17, 2018, 18:49:09 PM
Quote from: Dougfish on April 17, 2018, 17:58:54 PM
Quote from: Big J on April 17, 2018, 12:48:31 PM
James Bong carried a .32 acp.

James bong was a bag guge.

Haha. Darn auto correct. It is close to 4/20
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on April 17, 2018, 19:52:29 PM
Quote from: Big J on April 17, 2018, 12:48:31 PM
While I do agree you lose a lot going below 9mm, .380 has it's niche.  The thing .380 has going for it these days is advancements in ammo and size of the guns.  Bigger guns and more rounds are nice, if you can carry it.  Easier to pass on carrying for the day a double stack 15 round gun than it is a gun you can just slip in your pocket.  Also nice for situations where you do not want to print but want to have something.  The Lehigh .380 xtreme penetrators aren't a bad little .380 round. 

James Bong carried a .32 acp.

Totally agree - With good ammo the .380 in the pocket or inside your waistband is better then the cannon in your glove compartment or back home because it was too large to carry / conceal with the clothes you are wearing.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on April 18, 2018, 09:03:45 AM
OK, I'll bow to Al's superior knowledge on this one. I've been trying to find a 9mm small enough to really conceal. Never tried the .380 except with regular rounds and wasn't impressed.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Yallerhammer on April 18, 2018, 09:12:30 AM
Quote from: Phil on April 18, 2018, 09:03:45 AM
OK, I'll bow to Al's superior knowledge on this one. I've been trying to find a 9mm small enough to really conceal. Never tried the .380 except with regular rounds and wasn't impressed.

Ruger LC9s, hands down. I've carried mine on the beach in swimming trunks and a tshirt without even a belt.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: 22midge on April 18, 2018, 09:21:32 AM
what about the G17 ? opinions
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: FlyFisher22 on April 18, 2018, 10:04:29 AM
Quote from: Phil on April 18, 2018, 09:03:45 AM
OK, I'll bow to Al's superior knowledge on this one. I've been trying to find a 9mm small enough to really conceal. Never tried the .380 except with regular rounds and wasn't impressed.

Phil, you can play with my S&W Shield in a few few weeks.  I sold my G27 for the shield and haven't looked back, although that Sig does look pretty sweet.
Now if the would just make it DA/SA...

Cam
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on April 18, 2018, 14:15:49 PM
Currently 3 private sellers trying to sell the P365. Two want $700 and one wants $720 for it. Free market but I hope they can't sell them
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on April 18, 2018, 16:31:35 PM
Quote from: 22midge on April 18, 2018, 09:21:32 AM
what about the G17 ? opinions

Too big for EDC (for me, anyway), but the longer barrel would be nice. You were a shoulder holster guy -- it works for that....
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: 22midge on April 18, 2018, 16:43:59 PM
that's right Phil......armpit jewelry doubles ...Colts-Beretta....Glock
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: ryguy on April 18, 2018, 17:31:08 PM
I like my XD-S in the 4.0.  It works for me being left handed with an ambidextrous mag release.  I do like the G43, and it shot really well. 

I hope nobody pays $700 for the 365, all they need to do is wait and they can order one for $200 less!

So many options!


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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on April 18, 2018, 22:21:15 PM
Quote from: Yallerhammer on April 18, 2018, 09:12:30 AM
Ruger LC9s, hands down. I've carried mine on the beach in swimming trunks and a tshirt without even a belt.

In addition to a Ruger LCP  .380  I have a Ruger LC9s pro in 9mm.  It is larger than the LCP but depending on what I am wearing it is my go-to gun. I really love the trigger.  My .380 is not the II model and trigger is real stiff. Has anyone had both and how does the II compare to the original trigger.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on April 19, 2018, 07:54:05 AM
Quote from: Al on April 18, 2018, 22:21:15 PM
Quote from: Yallerhammer on April 18, 2018, 09:12:30 AM
Ruger LC9s, hands down. I've carried mine on the beach in swimming trunks and a tshirt without even a belt.

In addition to a Ruger LCP  .380  I have a Ruger LC9s pro in 9mm.  It is larger than the LCP but depending on what I am wearing it is my go-to gun. I really love the trigger.  My .380 is not the II model and trigger is real stiff. Has anyone had both and how does the II compare to the original trigger.

Get the LCP II.  The trigger is hands down one of the best out of box pocket gun triggers (Kahr may have it beat but it is close). The original LCP trigger is what always kept me from getting the LCP.  For a $300 gun, you cannot beat the LCP II.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on April 19, 2018, 09:17:39 AM
Conceding a screwed-up position, I am amused with any discussion of which weapon has the best stopping power or is the most comfortable to conceal, by folks that most likely have no first-hand evidence or support (luckily never had to pull the trigger or hopefully never will). 

So, from this 17-18April conversation I was forced to grudgingly recall the numbers.  We have more guns and approximately 80% of us believe in angels, and we might be a tad too paranoid.  Are we the greatest of the great?   

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estimated_number_of_guns_per_capita_by_country

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/poll-nearly-8-in-10-americans-believe-in-angels/

https://www.alternet.org/noam-chomsky-why-americans-are-paranoid-about-everything-including-zombies

http://youtu.be/VMqcLUqYqrs
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on April 19, 2018, 09:31:32 AM
Says the man who moved into the mountains away from society and doesn't fish with me anymore.

What did you do with that shotgun with the sights off Hiner? Did you send it back?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on April 19, 2018, 10:28:54 AM


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I just had to message him.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on April 19, 2018, 10:38:39 AM
Quote from: Big J on April 19, 2018, 09:31:32 AM
Says the man who moved into the mountains away from society and doesn't fish with me anymore.

What did you do with that shotgun with the sights off Hiner? Did you send it back?

No, I put a TruGlo Multireticle sight on it and now have a good pattern with the new combination 5,6, and 7 loads, out to ~ 40 yards. 

Missed a turkey on Sat.  – came down with  a bad case of turkey fever – trembling like a 15 year old boy on his first date – plus I really miscalculated the distance – added to the surprise that I actually called the peckerwood close – learning experience.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Yallerhammer on April 19, 2018, 11:10:48 AM
Quote from: 22midge on April 18, 2018, 09:21:32 AM
what about the G17 ? opinions

It's a fine pistol. I prefer the mid-sized ones like the 19 or 23 for EDC, though. I've toted a G23 every day for years, and love it. I have no idea why everybody thinks a pistol has to be a little tiny thing the size of a soda cracker to comfortably CC? Half of those little things I couldn't get enough grip on to hit the broad side of a barn.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on April 19, 2018, 12:26:46 PM
Let me see if I can get a 3rd strike.  Damn, you machosexuals are predictable!
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on April 19, 2018, 12:50:50 PM
I hope when we are sitting around the campfire you use some of these same arguments.  There are so many holes in these arguments/propaganda that it is like watching the 1919 World Series.

Also, can someone be non violently killed with a gun?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Yallerhammer on April 19, 2018, 14:39:58 PM
Freedom is scary to sheep people. I'd much rather be stabbed or acid-washed in London.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on April 19, 2018, 16:27:04 PM
Back to the subject at hand -- I looked at the G43, LC9s, and LC9sPro today at a shop. They didn't have a Shield to look at. Couldn't live fire them.
I'm actually considering the LC9s because of the manual safety. Figure I'll be carrying it sometimes not in a holster (back pocket or fishing vest) and the safety might be a good option. Also liked the feel of the trigger on the LC9s better than the Glock. I dunno. Options, options....  :-\
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on April 19, 2018, 20:33:51 PM
Quote from: Yallerhammer on April 19, 2018, 14:39:58 PM
I'd much rather be stabbed or acid-washed in London.

Not me!  I rather perish by asphyxia, between the creamy mid-aged thighs of our President's hoary concubine, Stormy Daniels.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: FlyFisher22 on April 20, 2018, 07:44:20 AM
Quote from: Phil on April 19, 2018, 16:27:04 PM
Back to the subject at hand -- I looked at the G43, LC9s, and LC9sPro today at a shop. They didn't have a Shield to look at. Couldn't live fire them.
I'm actually considering the LC9s because of the manual safety. Figure I'll be carrying it sometimes not in a holster (back pocket or fishing vest) and the safety might be a good option. Also liked the feel of the trigger on the LC9s better than the Glock. I dunno. Options, options....  :-\

I would still hold off to handle the shield, personally.  The thumb safety is an option on the shield as well, although I didn't go that route since I am always in a holster.  Would have to check with Irby/JT, but if they know somewhere acceptable to fire rounds, you are welcome to live fire my shield next month.  I can grab a box of ammo out of the safe to bring along. 

Cam
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: hcrum87hc on April 20, 2018, 07:53:17 AM
I usually carry my LCP or PPS M1.  The LCP goes with me during the week when I need to be extra inconspicuous, and the PPS goes with me everywhere else.  My wife used to have a Shield.  It was a fine gun, but the grip was too narrow for my liking.  I couldn't get a good purchase on it, and it tended to shift in my hand too much. 

In response to Mudwall's trolling, I just want to know where I can find an American flag Python...
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on April 20, 2018, 08:00:41 AM
I vote try the shield too.  They can come with and without safety, even though I'd recommend still having it in some kind of holster or pocket holster if you throw it into a pocket or vest. 

They also have a Performance Center Shield if you really want to treat yourself.  Comes with Tritium sights, smoother trigger, and ported barrel.  Fondled one a little while back.

https://www.smith-wesson.com/firearms/performance-center-ported-mp-9-shield-night-sights (https://www.smith-wesson.com/firearms/performance-center-ported-mp-9-shield-night-sights)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: hcrum87hc on April 20, 2018, 08:15:48 AM
Quote from: Big J on April 20, 2018, 08:00:41 AM
I vote try the shield too.  They can come with and without safety, even though I'd recommend still having it in some kind of holster or pocket holster if you throw it into a pocket or vest. 

I can't emphasize this enough.  I recommend always carrying in some kind of holster. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on April 20, 2018, 08:26:16 AM
Quote from: hcrum87hc on April 20, 2018, 08:15:48 AM
Quote from: Big J on April 20, 2018, 08:00:41 AM
I vote try the shield too.  They can come with and without safety, even though I'd recommend still having it in some kind of holster or pocket holster if you throw it into a pocket or vest. 

I can't emphasize this enough.  I recommend always carrying in some kind of holster.

I know, I know. My military training was a long time ago. I wasn't thinking.  b';

Cam, I appreciate the offer, but no firing at Irby's. Liability issues.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: FlyFisher22 on April 20, 2018, 10:54:46 AM
Yes, I assumed we couldn't start popping off rounds at camp...  Just meant if there was somewhere local. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Yallerhammer on April 20, 2018, 13:22:19 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on April 19, 2018, 20:33:51 PM
Quote from: Yallerhammer on April 19, 2018, 14:39:58 PM
I'd much rather be stabbed or acid-washed in London.

Not me!  I rather perish by asphyxia, between the creamy mid-aged thighs of our President's hoary concubine, Stormy Daniels.

No thanks. There's shit up in there that Clorox won't wash off.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on April 26, 2018, 15:43:49 PM
Well, after a few days of shopping/testing, I pulled the trigger and brought home a single-stack today. I like this one very much. It'll serve its purpose.
Shield 9 M2.0 and a Kybex IWB holster. Comfortable and inconspicuous.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on April 27, 2018, 07:45:20 AM
Quote from: Phil on April 26, 2018, 15:43:49 PM
Well, after a few days of shopping/testing, I pulled the trigger and brought home a single-stack today. I like this one very much. It'll serve its purpose.
Shield 9 M2.0 and a Kybex IWB holster. Comfortable and inconspicuous.

Can't go wrong with that.   V:;
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on May 09, 2018, 21:12:30 PM


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This followed me home  8)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on May 10, 2018, 06:20:42 AM
Sweet! I dunno where you found that puppy. The shops around here just laughed when I asked if they had one yet. Be interested in your review after you've put it through the paces....  /'/
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: ryguy on May 10, 2018, 06:26:48 AM
Awesome!  Bass Pro is advertising them  in their latest circular, although there is probably only 1 in stock..

I second the review after you have shot it.


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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on May 10, 2018, 07:57:14 AM
Gander Outdoors got 4 of them in yesterday.  Got the last one.  $499 is the best I've seen.  V:;

Only thing I do not like so far is I have to change my grip to hit the mag release.  If I don't the pressure from palm  on opposite side of handle keeps the reciprocating mag button on that side from pushing out.  Kind of awkward how they made that design. Seems like the would of recessed the cover for the mag release side not in use so it wouldn't protrude when you hit the mag release.  Hard to explain so hope that makes sense. 

On that note too, I like what Camping World is doing to Gander brand.  All the guns were priced good and ammo was excellent.  $9 for a box of brass 9mm.  Gander Mountain NEVER had those prices. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on May 10, 2018, 11:19:17 AM


Was itching for a test run so hit the range on my lunch break. 120 flawless rounds, 20 of those JHP. Decent accuracy for letting them rip at 15 ft. I like.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on May 10, 2018, 13:28:27 PM
All right, J. 20 feet and in is where it's at. Good shootin'.
Sounds like a good gun.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: ryguy on May 11, 2018, 17:04:22 PM
I had a breakfast meeting today, next to a gun store.  Which means I had to visit the gun store after and see if any Sig 365's were in stock.  They were selling the last one.  I got a quick look and it looks awesome.  Felt great, not too small but small enough.  Now I want to shoot one..


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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: 22midge on May 11, 2018, 18:09:17 PM
Had a Glock 19 FDE follow me home today......guess I might keep it
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on May 12, 2018, 07:21:36 AM
Quote from: 22midge on May 11, 2018, 18:09:17 PM
Had a Glock 19 FDE follow me home today......guess I might keep it

4 inch barrel = distance control for sure. Is it that tan Cerakote finish? Interesting.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on May 12, 2018, 12:38:13 PM
Quote from: ryguy on May 11, 2018, 17:04:22 PM
I had a breakfast meeting today, next to a gun store.  Which means I had to visit the gun store after and see if any Sig 365's were in stock.  They were selling the last one.  I got a quick look and it looks awesome.  Felt great, not too small but small enough.  Now I want to shoot one..


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Come on up

Quote from: 22midge on May 11, 2018, 18:09:17 PM
Had a Glock 19 FDE follow me home today......guess I might keep it


The 19 is a work horse. Now that they have that Ruger PC9 that takes glock mags I've contemplated switching from Sig P320 platform back to Glocks, but we'll see.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on June 29, 2018, 10:26:42 AM
Alright, J. What's the longer term range report on the P365?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on June 29, 2018, 10:44:11 AM
Short answer, Wait another couple months.

Mine has been flawless, but there are two concerns, firing pin dragging on primer and trigger reset spring dragging on mags. Mine has both issues.

Every P365 has primer drag, but the big issue is Sig uses MIM for firing pins and some are breaking. Sig recently beefed up the firing pin and the new firing pin should be shipping in July.

Some of the trigger bar reset springs protrude from frame and are not to spec. The spring hits the mag when compressed. Lots of broken springs at 500 - 1,000 rounds. You can tell if you have this issue by run marks on back right side of magazines. Mine unfortunately has those dreaded rub marks. Therefore I'm going to try and get a replacement spring from Sig and the updated firing pin. Wish Sig wouldn't use consumers for Beta testing....
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on June 29, 2018, 11:42:28 AM
Damn, I hate to hear that. Hope it gets worked out to your satisfaction.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: ryguy on June 29, 2018, 11:53:51 AM
A buddy of mine just had his ship yesterday from Brownells.  I'd heard about the firing pin issues, had not heard about the other spring issues.  That's a real bummer and I hope they get everything fixed soon.  It is certainly a pistol in high demand...
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on June 29, 2018, 12:05:52 PM
http://youtu.be/BYCCQjx0M8M

MAC had the spring issue. Lots of others have reported it. He did a follow up on what to look for and what exactly happened in another video.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on June 29, 2018, 13:51:47 PM
Just watched the video. Ouch.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: ryguy on June 29, 2018, 16:37:16 PM
Slow day at work... watched the video and it mirrors what I have read from others.  I hope any further issues are solved quickly.


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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on July 11, 2018, 19:46:41 PM


Ended up trading in at a gun store for a new Ruger PC9. Looks like it'll be a fun plinking carbine.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on July 12, 2018, 19:52:44 PM
Sweet looking carbine.  'c;


Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on July 19, 2018, 16:26:22 PM
Got about 1000 rounds of practice in so far -- also, joined the local gun club so's I can now go shoot anytime I want. Nary a problem with the Shield so far. I'm slowly getting better with my patterns at various distances and working on draw and 1 second or less repeated rounds.
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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on July 19, 2018, 17:35:15 PM
Quote from: Phil on July 19, 2018, 16:26:22 PM
Got about 1000 rounds of practice in so far -- also, joined the local gun club so's I can now go shoot anytime I want. Nary a problem with the Shield so far. I'm slowly getting better with my patterns at various distances and working on draw and 1 second or less repeated rounds.
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Nice. Glad the sheild is treating you well.  The mag springs ever loosen up for you?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on July 19, 2018, 18:03:04 PM
A little -- I don't worry about it anymore -- I got an UpLula magloader that works like a charm.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on August 09, 2018, 12:56:15 PM
Today -- draw and shoot as fast as possible. 14 rounds at 30 yards. 12"X18" silhouette target. Not great, but didn't miss body mass. That's farther away than I'll ever need to use the gun.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on August 09, 2018, 13:12:52 PM
Not bad at all for quick fire at 30 yards will a pocket pistol  V:;
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on August 15, 2018, 13:51:55 PM
Hey Big J -- Whaddya think? Beretta M9A3.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on August 15, 2018, 14:38:36 PM
Have fondled them and always hearing good things about them. Yankee Marshall on YouTube loves the Beretta 92's and M9's. Good all steel gun. Will last a few lifetimes.

You get bored look up Wilson Combat Brigadier. Talk about a nice looking Beretta.

Nice purchase.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on September 12, 2018, 11:38:55 AM


Put some more rounds thru the P365 today.  No issues, ate everything up.  Think the spring hitting the mags issue has corrected itself for now.  In picture below, you can see the two 10 round mags have wear from the spring in top right corner.  But the wear has not gotten worse.  Ran about 50 rounds through a new 12 rd mag today (mag on the right) and it doesn't have any of that wear on top right corner.  Happy to see that.

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I think if anyone wants to buy a P365, they are safe to do so now.  If you buy a P365 with a born on date mid July or later, it will have a new redesigned striker in it.  Have not heard of any of the new strikers breaking.  Wish Sig would do a recall to replace old strikers, but that are just replacing the ones that break. 

Also put some rounds through a newly installed APEX trigger and APEX connector in the G19.  Really liked that.   V:;

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on September 12, 2018, 12:15:17 PM
J, I'm glad they made some striker changes and hope your 365 will continue to perform as it should. It's quite a design.
I've gotten comfortable with my Shield 9 for CC and don't feel the need for the 2 or 3 extra rounds, but to each his own.  0:0
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on September 12, 2018, 12:23:03 PM
Quote from: Phil on September 12, 2018, 12:15:17 PM
J, I'm glad they made some striker changes and hope your 365 will continue to perform as it should. It's quite a design.
I've gotten comfortable with my Shield 9 for CC and don't feel the need for the 2 or 3 extra rounds, but to each his own.  0:0


Agreed.  Shield has a very nice proven track record of reliability going for it too.  Still miss mine on occasion.  And if you ever wanted, you could slap a +1 or +2 base plate on the mags. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: ryguy on September 12, 2018, 13:26:46 PM
Picked up my P365 a few weeks back, have to take it to the range soon.  Just received a Vedder holster for it.  Nice set up.

Hopefully once this hurricane passes I can shoot it, I was convinced after shooting my buddy's gun to start the search.


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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on September 12, 2018, 13:31:18 PM
Quote from: ryguy on September 12, 2018, 13:26:46 PM
Picked up my P365 a few weeks back, have to take it to the range soon.  Just received a Vedder holster for it.  Nice set up.

Hopefully once this hurricane passes I can shoot it, I was convinced after shooting my buddy's gun to start the search.


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What is your born on date?  Should be on sticker on box. 

I'm contemplating just biting the bullet and getting a Lightning Strike striker to replace original striker just for some peace of mind.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: ryguy on September 12, 2018, 15:23:52 PM
28 July build date.


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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on September 12, 2018, 15:32:40 PM
July 28 -- you should be good, Ryguy. Sig made some needed changes.

Holsters? I got several. The single clip Kydex I use for when I might need to take the whole shebang off and put it on repeatedly --
Concealment Express. Fairly comfortable and hides well.
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All day use -- Black Arch Protos-M. The beans. Totally comfortable and pretty much invisible.
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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: ryguy on September 12, 2018, 15:42:32 PM
I'll look into the Black Arch.  I've got a Vedder kydex.  Nice holster.


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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on September 12, 2018, 15:47:17 PM
I have a Concealment Express holster for my P365.  Gun is secure, but there is a little bit of wiggle to the gun when it is in the holster and the sweat guard is about a 1/5 of an inch short of covering the whole slide.  Think it helps sweat run into holster onto gun. Not a big deal, and probably a problem specific to the P365 run of holsters.

On that note though, Ryguy, make sure you keep her oiled up.  The mag release and sights like to rust up easy.  Wore the P365 while sweating outside once and didn't wipe it down when I got home, rust on the mag release button and sights when I took the gun out of the safe the next time.  Lots of reports of that being the case on the controls.  Wish they would of used stainless controls or a better finish, but oh well.  Good to practice proper maintenance anyways.  Never did have that issue with my Shield or LCP II and I never oiled them in between range sessions.

Let me know how you like the Vedder.  Never tried them out.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on September 12, 2018, 16:46:23 PM
J, maybe look at these for breathability, comfort, retention, etc. I love mine.
https://www.blackarchholsters.com/products/protos-m (https://www.blackarchholsters.com/products/protos-m)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on September 12, 2018, 21:26:19 PM
Quote from: Phil on September 12, 2018, 16:46:23 PM
J, maybe look at these for breathability, comfort, retention, etc. I love mine.
https://www.blackarchholsters.com/products/protos-m (https://www.blackarchholsters.com/products/protos-m)

Like the looks of that holster. May have to order one.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Grannyknot on September 13, 2018, 14:42:53 PM
Quote from: Big J on September 12, 2018, 15:47:17 PM
Gun is secure, but there is a little bit of wiggle to the gun when it is in the holster and the sweat guard is about a 1/5 of an inch short of covering the whole slide. 

Big J is out here measuring shits in fifths of an inch
5d chess

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on September 13, 2018, 16:37:46 PM
Quote from: Grannyknot on September 13, 2018, 14:42:53 PM
Quote from: Big J on September 12, 2018, 15:47:17 PM
Gun is secure, but there is a little bit of wiggle to the gun when it is in the holster and the sweat guard is about a 1/5 of an inch short of covering the whole slide. 

Big J is out here measuring shits in fifths of an inch


That is the protocol for a man with a 2 inch unit.  Not that I know J's true endowment, but that is what I heard from Doug. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on September 13, 2018, 18:08:25 PM
Every fifth counts.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on September 13, 2018, 18:53:39 PM
(Somebody has to say it)
That's what she said....   /'/
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: ryguy on September 14, 2018, 19:20:25 PM
Couple photos of the Vedder.  Simple holster, think it works well for the 365.  I have an alien gear also, but not the shell for this gun.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on September 16, 2018, 17:12:50 PM

Put another 100 rds through the P365. Ate it all up, including some crappy remanufactured junk and some aluminum case ammo. Not bad for letting them rip at 10 yards.

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Fun day. Ran 100 rds through the Ruger PC9 carbine too, had it jam once on the first mag, but ran good after that.


Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on September 16, 2018, 17:27:02 PM
Good shootin' for a subcompact, J.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on October 18, 2018, 18:57:57 PM
Got timed at the range today. 10 yards. Draw, fire 8 rounds in under 5 seconds, drop mag and put new one in, 7 rounds in 4 seconds. I missed body mass on the first round of the 2nd mag. Not enough in the center, though. Need more practice.
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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on October 18, 2018, 20:10:57 PM
For ten yards drawing and mag dumping, that's not bad.  V:;
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on October 19, 2018, 06:11:52 AM
Quote from: Phil on October 18, 2018, 18:57:57 PM
Got timed at the range today. 10 yards. Draw, fire 8 rounds in under 5 seconds, drop mag and put new one in, 7 rounds in 4 seconds. I missed body mass on the first round of the 2nd mag. Not enough in the center, though. Need more practice.
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I wouldn't want to be downrange. 

Nice shooting.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on October 19, 2018, 06:48:36 AM
I'm behind the times, as is typical, but I only this week got to take the rifle to the woods - in search of coyote not deer.

Sighting in was fun:

Starting point - 150 gr Hornady SST from the Rem 700 .30-06

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That is a 2" target circle at 200yds.  Not bad to start.

Finished with this 5-shot group - look closely, that 5th one is on the black line at 7 o-clock to the orange target(flier on left is from sighting in 165gr in same rifle, bottom one is the .308)

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Going after hogs tomorrow.

Fishing, or at least dreaming of fishing, while drinking beer on Sunday!
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on October 19, 2018, 07:51:30 AM
Is that 5 shot group at 200 yards or 100 yards?  If that is a 100 yard group, that is really good.  If it is a 200 yard group, I'm going to ask what you did to the 700 to get those results. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on October 19, 2018, 09:02:22 AM
200 yards?? That's friggin' awesome shooting.  bd;0

<Regretting my post/pic of  my "scattergun" results>
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on October 19, 2018, 09:03:56 AM
Quote from: Big J on October 19, 2018, 07:51:30 AM
Is that 5 shot group at 200 yards or 100 yards?  If that is a 100 yard group, that is really good.  If it is a 200 yard group, I'm going to ask what you did to the 700 to get those results.

That is 200yds off a bench. I usually have a sandbag, but I just rolled up the case and stuck it under the forearm. 

I used to shoot 600yds with this gun.  I always wanted to step up to 1,000yds, but the $$$ was out of my range at the time.  And I've never had time to develop hand loads.

Sold the Jewel trigger, re-worked the stock one; sold the competition stock setup, put a Magpul hunter on it (after years of running it with the factory wood that I glass-bedded); kept the receiver and bolt and put a new scope on it.

She's a tack driver.

One day I'll build a 1,000 yd gun . . . maybe.

Saw a big doe the other evening after bush hogging at a friend's farm.  She was 350+ yds away and if I had a tag, I would have thought about it. 

But probably not taken the shot.  I haven't put anything downrange at that distance in years and I hate to wound deer.  If I can't be confident it will fall where I shoot it, I'm probably not taking the shot.

I hate chasing deer.  I usually take head shots.  Never going to take anything to a taxidermist.

Raymond
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on October 19, 2018, 09:35:00 AM
If you are getting that kind of accuracy out of a .30-06 700, you should be able to hit a 16 inch plate at 1,000 yards.  I'm impressed.  I haven't stretched the Ruger 6.5 Creedmoor  out yet (been a busy year) but I'd be happy if it shot that good at 200 yards.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on October 19, 2018, 11:58:21 AM
Quote from: Big J on October 19, 2018, 09:35:00 AM
If you are getting that kind of accuracy out of a .30-06 700, you should be able to hit a 16 inch plate at 1,000 yards.  I'm impressed.  I haven't stretched the Ruger 6.5 Creedmoor  out yet (been a busy year) but I'd be happy if it shot that good at 200 yards.

Best I have shot is 5" groups at 600yds. Not really consistently, either.  Human-sized targets - yes. 

That doesn't really translate into 16" groups at 1,000.  Too many variables at that distance to be consistent. 

Lots of folks are loving the 6.5 Creedmoor guns.  If it doesn't shoot that well at 200, I'll be shocked.  If not, bench time will fix that.  Breathing, trigger control, good optics, and hand loading are the solutions to long shots.  Today's manufacturing tolerances are much better than they used to be.  Ammunition is better than it ever has been.

Accurizing, blueprinting, etc isn't necessary for long shots like it used to be. 

If I wanted a long-range hunting rifle these days, I would save my pennies and have a Jarrett built.  Long Ranger or find a good used action and have them make a Beanfield model.

http://www.jarrettrifles.com/rifle-models.html


I've sunk all my gun time and money into sporting clays the last several years.  I enjoy it more and spend more time with friends that way.  And teaching and coaching in the discipline is much more enjoyable than poking holes in paper to me.

Raymond
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on October 31, 2018, 14:03:05 PM
Getting better -- this is a rapid fire/multiple mags from today at 10 yards. Had 3 strays, but almost all are getting there.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on December 22, 2018, 16:24:26 PM
Hey Big J -- I got a little brother (from a different mother) to go with my Shield 9 -- shoots really well from 10 yards in. I wear it undetected even when playing music in front of people, it's so little.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on December 22, 2018, 17:04:23 PM
Quote from: rbphoto on October 19, 2018, 09:03:56 AM
Saw a big doe the other evening after bush hogging at a friend's farm.  She was 350+ yds away and if I had a tag, I would have thought about it. 


Quote from: rbphoto on October 19, 2018, 11:58:21 AM
Best I have shot is 5" groups at 600yds. Not really consistently, either.  Human-sized targets - yes. 

Just caught up reading this thread.

Where do you live that has a gun season on 19 Oct for deer?
And considering "human-sized targets"? 
You guys are frightening me!
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on December 22, 2018, 19:59:50 PM
Quote from: Phil on December 22, 2018, 16:24:26 PM
Hey Big J -- I got a little brother (from a different mother) to go with my Shield 9 -- shoots really well from 10 yards in. I wear it undetected even when playing music in front of people, it's so little.

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Look at you Phil going .380 on us. LCP II is my most carried gun these days. Love that little gun and the trigger blows me a way for a stock pocket .380. Recommend Hornady Critical Defense for ammo. Good expansion and penetration for a .380.  V:;
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on December 22, 2018, 22:35:24 PM
Quote from: Big J on December 22, 2018, 19:59:50 PM
Quote from: Phil on December 22, 2018, 16:24:26 PM
Hey Big J -- I got a little brother (from a different mother) to go with my Shield 9 -- shoots really well from 10 yards in. I wear it undetected even when playing music in front of people, it's so little.

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Look at you Phil going .380 on us. LCP II is my most carried gun these days. Love that little gun and the trigger blows me a way for a stock pocket .380. Recomend Hornady Critical Defense for ammo. Good expansion and penetration for a .380.  V:;

I recently traded my LCP for the LCP 2 based on you guys recomendation - there is a world of difference in the triggers. All of my old holsters still work which is a big plus - I am holster poor :embarassed: .  2nd the motion on Hornady Critical Defense ammo.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on December 23, 2018, 07:35:32 AM
Yeah man, the Ruger LCP II is a sweet little gun. Have you guys read up on the Underwood Xtreme Defender ammo? Not a hollow point due to .380 penetration concerns. Worth a look -- https://www.underwoodammo.com/products/380-acp-65-grain-xtreme-defender?variant=7865927761977 (https://www.underwoodammo.com/products/380-acp-65-grain-xtreme-defender?variant=7865927761977)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on December 23, 2018, 10:58:53 AM
36 pages!!!   Yes I know, it does not rival the 182 pages of "The smitage of The Dude".   But, it makes me reason that we are undeniably in love with our guns.   And this is a fishing site.  I wonder if 'For the love of rods' would garner 36 pages? 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on December 23, 2018, 15:27:09 PM
Sure, Muddy. Why don't you start one? I didn't know some guys here liked fishing rods as well.  -+;
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on December 23, 2018, 16:44:50 PM
Quote from: Phil on December 23, 2018, 07:35:32 AM
Yeah man, the Ruger LCP II is a sweet little gun. Have you guys read up on the Underwood Xtreme Defender ammo? Not a hollow point due to .380 penetration concerns. Worth a look -- https://www.underwoodammo.com/products/380-acp-65-grain-xtreme-defender?variant=7865927761977 (https://www.underwoodammo.com/products/380-acp-65-grain-xtreme-defender?variant=7865927761977)

Xtreme defender and Xtreme penetrator is on my list of approved ammo for .380. Just never have seen them in the store and Hornady Critical Defense is widely available.  All the ballistic test I've seen seem to show 13" of penetration and about .50" expanded with the 90 grain Hornady Critical Defense. I think the Extreme Defenders are around the 18" mark of penetration if memory serves. Both are solid choices.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dougfish on December 23, 2018, 18:05:38 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on December 23, 2018, 10:58:53 AM
36 pages!!!   Yes I know, it does not rival the 182 pages of "The smitage of The Dude".   But, it makes me reason that we are undeniably in love with our guns.   And this is a fishing site.  I wonder if 'For the love of rods' would garner 36 pages?

I could do a tutorial on old fiberglass from the 50's and continue to skew the numbers downward?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: ryguy on December 23, 2018, 20:06:36 PM
Quote from: Dougfish on December 23, 2018, 18:05:38 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on December 23, 2018, 10:58:53 AM
36 pages!!!   Yes I know, it does not rival the 182 pages of "The smitage of The Dude".   But, it makes me reason that we are undeniably in love with our guns.   And this is a fishing site.  I wonder if 'For the love of rods' would garner 36 pages?

I could do a tutorial on old fiberglass from the 50's and continue to skew the numbers downward?

What about going a little further back to greenheart rods?  I'd honestly be curious how one of those would cast, besides being heavy compared to today's graphite...

On the guns topic, have carried both my Stevens 311 and Ruger Red Label this year, both are great to take on hunts.  Picked up a Vedder holster for my P365, really enjoying that too!


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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: croaker on December 23, 2018, 20:28:54 PM
Quote from: Phil on December 23, 2018, 07:35:32 AM
Yeah man, the Ruger LCP II is a sweet little gun. Have you guys read up on the Underwood Xtreme Defender ammo? Not a hollow point due to .380 penetration concerns. Worth a look -- https://www.underwoodammo.com/products/380-acp-65-grain-xtreme-defender?variant=7865927761977 (https://www.underwoodammo.com/products/380-acp-65-grain-xtreme-defender?variant=7865927761977)

The LCP II is one I've been looking at as well. 
Have carried a Walther PPS SS for years that feels good in hand, accurate and reliable.
Want something a little lighter to carry.  Going to try and find some of the Xtreme defender ammo.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on December 24, 2018, 07:57:17 AM
Hey, Don. I'm using the Underwood Xtreme Defender rounds for SD carrying. It's expensive, so I just shot a box of 20 out of the LCP II to make sure it would work in the gun and use other cheaper stuff for range use. No problems at all with the Underwood. I had to order it online through https://www.cheaperthandirt.com/category/ammunition.do (https://www.cheaperthandirt.com/category/ammunition.do) -- couldn't find it around here.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on December 24, 2018, 10:19:41 AM
Xtreme Defender, Xtreme penetrator, Critical Defense ---- defend against what/whom, penetrate into what/whom?  I know, a rhetorical question.   Probably just me, but the labeling of certain firearms and the ammo have always made me a tad uncomfortable.   Stop the bad guy, yes, but personally, slaying someone would be a life changer I don't believe I could handle.  I realize I would have made a piss-poor soldier. 
   
Have we allowed the firearm/ammo industry to exploit our passion and/or fear with the catchy labeling?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on December 24, 2018, 11:29:24 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on December 24, 2018, 10:19:41 AM
Xtreme Defender, Xtreme penetrator, Critical Defense ---- defend against what/whom, penetrate into what/whom?  I know, a rhetorical question.   Probably just me, but the labeling of certain firearms and the ammo have always made me a tad uncomfortable.   Stop the bad guy, yes, but personally, slaying someone would be a life changer I don't believe I could handle.  I realize I would have made a piss-poor soldier. 
   
Have we allowed the firearm/ammo industry to exploit our passion and/or fear with the catchy labeling?

The answer to your second question is yes. The firearm/ammo industry uses "catchy" labeling just like every other industry.
Would you have made a piss-poor soldier? I dunno, Muddy. I don't think anybody knows until they are in the situation. Slaying someone is indeed a life changer.  So is getting slayed.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on December 24, 2018, 12:57:26 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on December 24, 2018, 10:19:41 AM
Xtreme Defender, Xtreme penetrator, Critical Defense ---- defend against what/whom, penetrate into what/whom?  I know, a rhetorical question.   Probably just me, but the labeling of certain firearms and the ammo have always made me a tad uncomfortable.   Stop the bad guy, yes, but personally, slaying someone would be a life changer I don't believe I could handle.  I realize I would have made a piss-poor soldier. 
   
Have we allowed the firearm/ammo industry to exploit our passion and/or fear with the catchy labeling?

Unfortunately a lot of the ammo and gun industry likes tacticool names and labels. Kind of started in the 80's and 90's. Anyone remember the street sweeper?  The gun was basically a pump shotgun but they way they marketed it got it banned.

Related note, extreme penetrator round would make an awesome grizzly bear round if carrying out west.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on December 25, 2018, 10:43:34 AM
Quote from: Phil on December 24, 2018, 11:29:24 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on December 24, 2018, 10:19:41 AM
Xtreme Defender, Xtreme penetrator, Critical Defense ---- defend against what/whom, penetrate into what/whom?  I know, a rhetorical question.   Probably just me, but the labeling of certain firearms and the ammo have always made me a tad uncomfortable.   Stop the bad guy, yes, but personally, slaying someone would be a life changer I don't believe I could handle.  I realize I would have made a piss-poor soldier. 
   
Have we allowed the firearm/ammo industry to exploit our passion and/or fear with the catchy labeling?

The answer to your second question is yes. The firearm/ammo industry uses "catchy" labeling just like every other industry.
Would you have made a piss-poor soldier? I dunno, Muddy. I don't think anybody knows until they are in the situation. Slaying someone is indeed a life changer.  So is getting slayed.

The big differencce between slaying someone and getting slayed is you can only get slayed once.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: 22midge on December 25, 2018, 12:16:30 PM
Muddy my Friend ...slaying someone is not something anyone finds easy to handle but after you zip a few body bags you learn quickly that there is someone making the same decision that you are. Then the question becomes who is going to survive....Merry Christmas and Happy New Year
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on December 26, 2018, 18:05:53 PM
https://youtu.be/rhBwHiLcTG8

For Hiner :banana072:
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on December 30, 2018, 10:37:35 AM


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Never have owned a CZ, and found this CZ 75b that went home with me. Trigger was a little far for me so I installed a Cajun Gun Works Reach Reduction Kit and Short Reset Kit. Trigger in single action is border line 1911 with a really nice reset now. I've worked on a lot of guns but this CZ takes the cake on pain in the rear. Bunch of staked pins and the sear assembly was a pain to get springs put back into.



Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on December 30, 2018, 11:00:23 AM
Sweet.! I've always heard CZ's were hard to work on. Wouldn't dream of trying to install anything in one.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on December 30, 2018, 11:44:26 AM
Hard is an understatement. To remove the pin for the hammer and disconnect you have to set it on a wood block, take a 5 lb hammer and a special starter punch and beat the snot out of it for 30 minutes. Why CZ stakes those pins like that still baffles me. A pin and blue loctite is sufficient. Those springs in the sear cage I gave up on 3 different occasions. Lost the sear spring first time. Had to order a new one. Second time I gave up in frustration. Third time I ran out of time. FOURTH time I got lucky and got it. I literally sat there in disbelief that it was finished. May of cried a little.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dougfish on December 30, 2018, 12:50:04 PM
Santa is a gun dealer?  :o
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on December 31, 2018, 13:26:19 PM


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Went to the range today for a short trip.  Dumped some rounds thru the CZ.  Ate up 150 rounds.  Like the trigger, like the gun.  Was shooting a tad to the left but tightened it up as I warmed up with the gun.  Have some new sights I ordered.  Stock sights are garbage and very hard to pick up.  Since it's a range toy I bought some Dawson Fiber Optic sights to slap on her.  Should be good to go after that.


Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on December 31, 2018, 15:01:30 PM
Good shootin'.  y;
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 04, 2019, 15:25:45 PM


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Going along with my earlier comments about extreme penetrator being a good bear round.

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 06, 2019, 12:38:36 PM
Over the holidays I had a distant cousin give me his late granddad's and dad's Winchester 94 in .25-.35.  I checked the serial and it was made in 1930.
 
The only stipulations of the gift were 1) I give it to my son and he gives it to his new son, Oakley, 2) I fire it 3 times at my cousin's funeral, and 3) I give his eulogy.  Not a bad deal.

In my youth I had admired the rifle for years when it was propped in the corner of his parent's mudroom.  It has ¼ of a buffalo nickel for the front sight and his late dad harvested many critters with the firearm. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on January 06, 2019, 15:22:33 PM
Very cool, Muddy.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on January 06, 2019, 15:35:04 PM
Hey, Muddy's post got me thinking -- I can't remember if I ever mentioned/posted this here before. My grandfather's 1890's Krag Springfield that he used in the Spanish-American War. It's mine now and still in working condition, although I've not fired it.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on January 06, 2019, 21:07:40 PM
Well I am not as old as  this will make me sound :laugh:  but I remember a childhood friend whose dad had a lot of old guns. One of them was the 25-35 that Muddy mentioned. We knew it was a little light for deer hunting but there were so many kids in that family that one of them ended up with it when I went on my first deer hunt. I took a 410 / 22 over/under. Shot at and missed my first deer with that thing. Deer were running and I just pointed it in general direction and pulled the trigger which I assummed missed (Back in those days if they didn't drop we were not smart enough to go check for blood :embarassed:)

That fellow's dad also had a 30-40 Krag much like the one Phil showed. I think a lot of them ended up being sold as government surplus and were used as deer rifles back in the day.  Another military surplus that found a lot of favor in the deer woods was the British 303 Enfield.


BTW my father had an octagon barreled 30-30.  Not sure who made them. Sure wish I had it today.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 08, 2019, 14:07:11 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 06, 2019, 12:38:36 PM
Over the holidays I had a distant cousin give me his late granddad's and dad's Winchester 94 in .25-.35.  I checked the serial and it was made in 1930.
 
The only stipulations of the gift were 1) I give it to my son and he gives it to his new son, Oakley, 2) I fire it 3 times at my cousin's funeral, and 3) I give his eulogy.  Not a bad deal.

In my youth I had admired the rifle for years when it was propped in the corner of his parent's mudroom.  It has ¼ of a buffalo nickel for the front sight and his late dad harvested many critters with the firearm.

A 1930's 94 is worth a chunk of money.  Holds more nostalgic value I'm sure.  If the gun is in decent shape, I bet that bluing is gorgeous.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 08, 2019, 17:09:58 PM
Quote from: Big J on January 08, 2019, 14:07:11 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 06, 2019, 12:38:36 PM
Over the holidays I had a distant cousin give me his late granddad's and dad's Winchester 94 in .25-.35.  I checked the serial and it was made in 1930.
 
The only stipulations of the gift were 1) I give it to my son and he gives it to his new son, Oakley, 2) I fire it 3 times at my cousin's funeral, and 3) I give his eulogy.  Not a bad deal.

In my youth I had admired the rifle for years when it was propped in the corner of his parent's mudroom.  It has ¼ of a buffalo nickel for the front sight and his late dad harvested many critters with the firearm.


A 1930's 94 is worth a chunk of money.  Holds more nostalgic value I'm sure.  If the gun is in decent shape, I bet that bluing is gorgeous.

The sentimental value outweighs the $ worth for sure.  There's a story from my youth behind the gun and I like to tell stories.   As I said, I admired the gun for years. 

The gun was a stage prop in the saga of the worse whipping I ever received from my late father.    I was 11 or 12 at the time and had heard the outdoor adventures from deep in Jim Dave Run from some of the older boys. They had built a canvas/wood hut and had spent the night there on several occasions.  I was mesmerized by their tales; I wanted to see it.  After church (yes, I went to church) one Sunday, they planned to return to check out their woodsy camp.    I begged my dad and he let me go.  Joe, Danny, and David were 5+ years older but agreed to let me see their homemade camp.   We each retrieved a firearm from David's dad's stock.  David carried the 94 25-35 (the one he gave me recently), I selected a single shot 22, Danny packed a 16 gauge single shot, and Joe has a 22 revolver.  During the ~3 mile walk to their camp I shot a squirrel, Joe nailed a young coon, Danny shot a fat doe with buckshot on an illegal deer drive, and David with his 94 shot the head off a flying grouse.   Danny has passed but 3 of us remain to vouch for the shot.  After that bang of that 94, I was positive the gun was special.  We cleaned the deer, and ate the squirrel and grouse by their fire ring.  I remember the coon (or its prep) being uneatable.  Dark approached and we were several hours getting back to the Back Creek valley.  At the mouth of Jim Dave Run waited my dad and my uncle Calvin, convinced the bunch of boys were in trouble.  My mother happened to be in the hospital at the time, so home provided no protection from my dad's wrath.   My dad and I laughed about that butt whipping much later.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: ARontheFly on January 13, 2019, 14:43:46 PM
Quote from: sanjuanwormhatch on October 10, 2014, 13:31:56 PM
QuoteThese racial fears may seem like they belong to another era, but sometimes the present looks like the past, one historian says.

There was a run on gun stores when President Obama was elected and another when he was re-elected. There was also a run on gun stores just before President Clinton signed the Federal Assault Weapons ban in 1994. One historian, however, says the surges in gun sales that accompanied Obama's elections were reminiscent of another era.

Or, rather than racism, maybe the obama gun rush was instigated by the fear of gun control laws, not that the person just elected was black (or whatever the hail he is).  It is especially ironic that after trying to make the point, the author points out an example of where gun control instigated a gun rush.
[/i]

Not to argue, but while we're shooting the shit regarding that topic;

I wouldn't hesitate to say all of the above. At the time Obama was running for office I was a teenager hanging around a gun/fly shop located in the wealthiest area of Nashville, the shop functioned as a men's hang with sitting chairs set up in the corner like a cigar lounge. Not that i give a shit about the who's who folks in my town but i clearly recall several very wealthy men from prominent Nashville families making comments such as; direct quote here- "if Obama gets in office i need to be sure i have plenty of ammo so when they think they can come after us." This was not a one time thing, this was their narrative most days the closer it got to the election. Not always so direct as the above comment, but race a.k.a. the people filling the ghettos only a few miles as the crow flies from their prominent area was always reffered to in their talks regarding Obama and gun control.


Racisim is ancient, we are simple creatures in those respects. We look for any differences in everything in the world to build ourselves a narrative, its in our nature, its how our brains interpet reality. As a great Knoxville author once wrote-

"The truth about the world, he said, is that anything is possible. Had you not seen it all from birth and thereby bled it of its strangeness it would appear to you for what it is, a hat trick in a medicine show, a fevered dream, a trance bepopulate with chimeras having neither analogue nor precedent, an itinerant carnival, a migratory tentshow whose ultimate destination after many a pitch in many a mudded field is unspeakable and calamitous beyond reckoning.

The universe is no narrow thing and the order within it is not constrained by any latitude in its conception to repeat what exists in one part in any other part. Even in this world more things exist without our knowledge than with it and the order in creation which you see is that which you have put there, like a string in a maze, so that you shall not lose your way. For existence has its own order and that no man's mind can compass, that mind itself being but a fact among others."

History isn't so much a study on the past as it is a study on who we are and what this place is we call the world and how we operate/interact within it as a species, both with eachother and the earth.


I wouldn't consider myself a conservative or a liberal, I'd propbably be conning myself to make the classic "i fall somewhere in between," claim.


All this to say, most everything always plays a factor and fuck news outlets on both sides that cause such a binary outlook on the world. We must keep in mind that ever since soapboxes, printed word and the arrival of modern day click bait articles; news is a business and the more views/clicks they get the more money they make.


I'm gonna go have a few beers so I can't balance on my own soap box now.

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: ARontheFly on January 13, 2019, 14:58:17 PM
HAHAHA sorry guys, I clicked on this thread and accidently thought Mudwall's original post was the most recent post.

On a more related note to the thread, I'm going to my parents house to search for an old 22LR
that lived in the back of their closet for years. Trying to figure out if it was my gradfathers or one they
picked up from another relative along the way. Will report back, hope its not rusted too bad. Just started
my squirrel hunting carreer this year.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on January 13, 2019, 17:35:39 PM
Personally I don't think the run on guns and ammo had or has anything to do with race. Fact is, some of the most anti-gun legislators are white folks. Check out Hillary, Blumberg, McAuliffe, Feinstein, etc, etc and they are all for restricting guns for the masses but not for themselves or those they hire to protect them. Same folks are also claiming walls don't work except around their own property.  It is also instructive that most of the places with high crime or mass shootings are the ones with the the most restrictive gun laws.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 13, 2019, 18:29:28 PM
Quote from: Al on January 13, 2019, 17:35:39 PM
Personally I don't think the run on guns and ammo had or has anything to do with race. Fact is, some of the most anti-gun legislators are white folks. Check out Hillary, Blumberg, McAuliffe, Feinstein, etc, etc and they are all for restricting guns for the masses but not for themselves or those they hire to protect them. Same folks are also claiming walls don't work except around their own property.  It is also instructive that most of the places with high crime or mass shootings are the ones with the the most restrictive gun laws.

It ain't "instructive"; it is bullshit!

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/6-things-to-know-about-mass-shootings-in-america/

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/more-guns-do-not-stop-more-crimes-evidence-shows/


More guns equal more mass shootings and crime.  Good luck with that wall, Al. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Onslow on January 13, 2019, 21:13:44 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 13, 2019, 18:29:28 PM
  Good luck with that wall, Al.

Allowing the floodgates to be open to the desperate impoverished hordes along with very cruel, smart, and enterprising criminals is not an option.  If you don't have  a better plan, then don't mock the wall.  Some pretend nothing will happen if there is no border security.  Good luck with that!

Drought, overpopulation, desperation will be followed by some unpleasant choices for those that have, and it does not involve feeding the poor, but more like stand your ground and kill, or be killed.  Said perturbations will not happen is some distant nebulous future, it will happen in our lifetime.  Droughts push desperate people over the edge.  It happened in Syria, and now some are asserting that droughts are triggering migration from Central America.  The earth can only sustain but so many humans, and at some point something will have to give. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 14, 2019, 06:45:25 AM
Quote from: Onslow on January 13, 2019, 21:13:44 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 13, 2019, 18:29:28 PM
  Good luck with that wall, Al.

Allowing the floodgates to be open to the desperate impoverished hordes along with very cruel, smart, and enterprising criminals is not an option.  If you don't have  a better plan, then don't mock the wall.  Some pretend nothing will happen if there is no border security.  Good luck with that!

Drought, overpopulation, desperation will be followed by some unpleasant choices for those that have, and it does not involve feeding the poor, but more like stand your ground and kill, or be killed.  Said perturbations will not happen is some distant nebulous future, it will happen in our lifetime.  Droughts push desperate people over the edge.  It happened in Syria, and now some are asserting that droughts are triggering migration from Central America.  The earth can only sustain but so many humans, and at some point something will have to give.

The "very cruel, smart, and enterprising criminals" are already here; they were born here.  I will mock the wall, because a 2000 mile wall is not achievable.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 14, 2019, 09:14:59 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 13, 2019, 18:29:28 PM
Quote from: Al on January 13, 2019, 17:35:39 PM
Personally I don't think the run on guns and ammo had or has anything to do with race. Fact is, some of the most anti-gun legislators are white folks. Check out Hillary, Blumberg, McAuliffe, Feinstein, etc, etc and they are all for restricting guns for the masses but not for themselves or those they hire to protect them. Same folks are also claiming walls don't work except around their own property.  It is also instructive that most of the places with high crime or mass shootings are the ones with the the most restrictive gun laws.

It ain't "instructive"; it is bullshit!

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/6-things-to-know-about-mass-shootings-in-america/

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/more-guns-do-not-stop-more-crimes-evidence-shows/


More guns equal more mass shootings and crime.  Good luck with that wall, Al.


BS Hiner.  Weak premise.  There are stats that talk about guns prevent exponentially more deaths and defensive uses than they are used for homicide and crime.


https://www.forbes.com/sites/paulhsieh/2018/03/20/any-study-of-gun-violence-should-include-how-guns-save-lives/#20cb56755edc (https://www.forbes.com/sites/paulhsieh/2018/03/20/any-study-of-gun-violence-should-include-how-guns-save-lives/#20cb56755edc)


There are studies putting the amount to defensive uses of firearm up to 2.5 million a year.  You can find studies that put it at 100,000, but look at their criteria for "defensive uses". CDC put the amounts in a range from 60,000 to 120,000, but added that it could be up to 2.5 million since data on defensive use of a firearm is not a data point that is accumulated by police departments and a lot of times goes unreported to police. 

The amount of guns in the US has gone up and the amount of violent crime has continued to go down. 

Homicide if a gun is in a home goes up by 1.41 times?  You do realize that the rate of a homicide with a firearm in the US is .00448%.  So that brings it up to .00632%?  I call BS on that and the difference can probably be chalked up to nothing more than margin of error. 



Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: hcrum87hc on January 14, 2019, 09:57:20 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 13, 2019, 18:29:28 PM
Quote from: Al on January 13, 2019, 17:35:39 PM
Personally I don't think the run on guns and ammo had or has anything to do with race. Fact is, some of the most anti-gun legislators are white folks. Check out Hillary, Blumberg, McAuliffe, Feinstein, etc, etc and they are all for restricting guns for the masses but not for themselves or those they hire to protect them. Same folks are also claiming walls don't work except around their own property.  It is also instructive that most of the places with high crime or mass shootings are the ones with the the most restrictive gun laws.

It ain't "instructive"; it is bullshit!

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/6-things-to-know-about-mass-shootings-in-america/

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/more-guns-do-not-stop-more-crimes-evidence-shows/


More guns equal more mass shootings and crime.  Good luck with that wall, Al.

To be fair, he didn't say more guns equals less crime, which is what your articles argue against.  Mass shootings do tend to happen in gun free zones: schools, churches (I know they're not all gun free), concerts/theaters, etc.  You can also look at places like Chicago and their shootings.  Chicago has some of the most restrictive gun laws, but as of July last year, over 1400 people had been shot. 

https://www.chicagotribune.com/g00/news/local/breaking/ct-met-weekend-shooting-violence-20180709-story.html?i10c.ua=1&i10c.encReferrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8%3d&i10c.dv=2 (https://www.chicagotribune.com/g00/news/local/breaking/ct-met-weekend-shooting-violence-20180709-story.html?i10c.ua=1&i10c.encReferrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8%3d&i10c.dv=2)

Also, speaking as someone who bought more guns and related items during the Obama era, it had nothing to do with race and everything to do with the concern of future legislation.  I don't care what color someone's skin is when it comes to defending myself and my family. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 14, 2019, 19:47:34 PM
Quote from: Big J on January 14, 2019, 09:14:59 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 13, 2019, 18:29:28 PM
Quote from: Al on January 13, 2019, 17:35:39 PM
Personally I don't think the run on guns and ammo had or has anything to do with race. Fact is, some of the most anti-gun legislators are white folks. Check out Hillary, Blumberg, McAuliffe, Feinstein, etc, etc and they are all for restricting guns for the masses but not for themselves or those they hire to protect them. Same folks are also claiming walls don't work except around their own property.  It is also instructive that most of the places with high crime or mass shootings are the ones with the the most restrictive gun laws.

It ain't "instructive"; it is bullshit!

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/6-things-to-know-about-mass-shootings-in-america/

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/more-guns-do-not-stop-more-crimes-evidence-shows/


More guns equal more mass shootings and crime.  Good luck with that wall, Al.


BS Hiner.  Weak premise.  There are stats that talk about guns prevent exponentially more deaths and defensive uses than they are used for homicide and crime.


https://www.forbes.com/sites/paulhsieh/2018/03/20/any-study-of-gun-violence-should-include-how-guns-save-lives/#20cb56755edc (https://www.forbes.com/sites/paulhsieh/2018/03/20/any-study-of-gun-violence-should-include-how-guns-save-lives/#20cb56755edc)


There are studies putting the amount to defensive uses of firearm up to 2.5 million a year.  You can find studies that put it at 100,000, but look at their criteria for "defensive uses". CDC put the amounts in a range from 60,000 to 120,000, but added that it could be up to 2.5 million since data on defensive use of a firearm is not a data point that is accumulated by police departments and a lot of times goes unreported to police. 

The amount of guns in the US has gone up and the amount of violent crime has continued to go down. 

Homicide if a gun is in a home goes up by 1.41 times?  You do realize that the rate of a homicide with a firearm in the US is .00448%.  So that brings it up to .00632%?  I call BS on that and the difference can probably be chalked up to nothing more than margin of error.


J, your verbiage reminded me of the nonsensical saying, "If I had ham, I'd have ham and eggs, if I had eggs". 

With my blinders securely on, I know that the U.S. is the top civilian gun-owning country, and in the U.S. over 60% of homicides are gun related, and we, good old America, are either #1 or around #11 in mass shootings (depending on the inclusion of rate per population).  Plus, you must admit we do have absolute ease in obtaining firearms.   Tightening and adjusting those little side blinkers, scrutinizing those numbers, the facts, I have come to the conclusion we have a gun problem, because, with conviction, I am sure we don't have a greater number of crazies in this country over other civilized nations. 

Peace, you bunch of Moloch-gun-loving peckerwoods (Leviticus 18.21, 20.1-5 for the biblically challenged).  I am open for inducement on our number of crazies, if anyone is interested.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Onslow on January 14, 2019, 21:34:08 PM
If this great nation would rid itself of its loser drug user population, homicide deaths would plummet across the entire Western Hemisphere, and so would forced emigration, and illegal immigration. Party on, and continue celebrate infants in detox, black on black killings, and the Latino invasion.  The party can't stop.

Drug users are merely fukk-up wannabes too stupid to go pro, and regular abusers don't deserve to take their next breath of air.  I find it incomprehensible that so many born with reasonably functioning brains are so oblivious, and indifferent to the horrors stemming this detestable behavior.  I was born retarded, but was able to comprehend the consequences of opiate, and meth abuse in the abstract at a fairly young age.  Intelligent folk aspiring to be retards also don't deserve the next breath of air.

Time to throw them non sequitur sammiches in the garbage.

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 14, 2019, 22:09:01 PM
Quote from: Onslow on January 14, 2019, 21:34:08 PM
Party on, ................. and the Latino invasion. 

Ken, I see you've visited Galax recently.  Party on!

https://www.npr.org/2018/07/17/627251940/amid-a-hispanic-boom-conflicting-feelings-on-immigration
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: wildmttwalleye on January 14, 2019, 22:40:24 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 14, 2019, 22:09:01 PM
Quote from: Onslow on January 14, 2019, 21:34:08 PM
Party on, ................. and the Latino invasion. 

Ken, I see you've visited Galax recently.  Party on!

https://www.npr.org/2018/07/17/627251940/amid-a-hispanic-boom-conflicting-feelings-on-immigration
How did I miss this?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Onslow on January 15, 2019, 06:47:43 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 14, 2019, 22:09:01 PM
Quote from: Onslow on January 14, 2019, 21:34:08 PM
Party on, ................. and the Latino invasion. 

Ken, I see you've visited Galax recently.  Party on!

https://www.npr.org/2018/07/17/627251940/amid-a-hispanic-boom-conflicting-feelings-on-immigration

Mountain Grove hasn't been included in the party yet, but it will, at some point.  You will become uncomfortable when it does.  Keep on being smug about it.

Hiner, you have no clue how difficult it is to manage the workers that are both illiterate in their native language, and have no math skills. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 15, 2019, 08:04:10 AM
Quote from: Onslow on January 15, 2019, 06:47:43 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 14, 2019, 22:09:01 PM
Quote from: Onslow on January 14, 2019, 21:34:08 PM
Party on, ................. and the Latino invasion. 

Ken, I see you've visited Galax recently.  Party on!

https://www.npr.org/2018/07/17/627251940/amid-a-hispanic-boom-conflicting-feelings-on-immigration

Mountain Grove hasn't been included in the party yet, but it will, at some point.  You will become uncomfortable when it does.  Keep on being smug about it.

Hiner, you have no clue how difficult it is to manage the workers that are both illiterate in their native language, and have no math skills.

I'm not being smug; I am poking fun at you.

My beloved Mt. Grove has been invited to the party.  Rt 39 is a major corridor for drugs entering from Pocahontas County WV.  I've observed the movement, as a member of the local fire/rescue, late at night, while directing traffic.  Shine a light in their stopped vehicle, law enforcement nearby but doing their own accident thing, see the perspiration, both hands on the wheel, white knuckles, no eye contact, no dialogue, windows up.

Now the nearest thing we have to immigrants is an immigration lawyer that purchased a farm on Little Back Creek.  Hell fire, if Galax can handle it, perhaps we can.  If I happen to win the lottery, which is not likely, I told my wife we would contact some humanitarian immigration entity and give, yes give, an immigrant family my late parent's home, plus try to find the family's breadwinner a job.  Party on!

My lone experience with immigrant workers was before I departed the NRV and had a new roof put on our home.  I shopped around, found a well referenced roofer, met with the pearly white owner/boss/foreman, got a written quote, and made a date/time.

The entire crew of about 15 showed on time, in several work vehicles, all eagerly jumped out, jabbering in Spanish with bits of broken English, each subgroup tackling a particular task, 30 minute lunch, back to work, job completed, and not an old nail or piece of shingle to be found. 
   
I approached the owner/boss, who remained with his crew all day, on why so many immigrant workers.  He was blunt:  they show up, they arrive sober/lucid, they work hard, they do good work, and they did not quit after 1 or 2 paychecks. 

Perhaps this was an outlier, an anomaly, or perhaps roofing requires little language or math skills, or perhaps the immigrants in your area need a new fucking boss. 

Gun related:  I did not observe any of the workers, or boss, with a sidearm.  Must have been in their work vehicles.

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 15, 2019, 09:01:01 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 14, 2019, 19:47:34 PM
J, your verbiage reminded me of the nonsensical saying, "If I had ham, I'd have ham and eggs, if I had eggs". 

With my blinders securely on, I know that the U.S. is the top civilian gun-owning country, and in the U.S. over 60% of homicides are gun related, and we, good old America, are either #1 or around #11 in mass shootings (depending on the inclusion of rate per population).  Plus, you must admit we do have absolute ease in obtaining firearms.   Tightening and adjusting those little side blinkers, scrutinizing those numbers, the facts, I have come to the conclusion we have a gun problem, because, with conviction, I am sure we don't have a greater number of crazies in this country over other civilized nations. 

Peace, you bunch of Moloch-gun-loving peckerwoods (Leviticus 18.21, 20.1-5 for the biblically challenged).  I am open for inducement on our number of crazies, if anyone is interested.

I'm really not sure how guns are easy to obtain.  Have to go through a background check whether you buy them at gun store, gun show, or interwebs.  Only way to not go through a background check is in private transactions and the seller is required by law to authenticate they are not selling to a felon or a person prohibited from purchasing firearms.  Liability falls on seller. 

Issue is people believe firearms are the issue when it is people.  Take Britian for example.  You have police confiscating butter knives from people and toting it as "another knife off the street".  You can always blame an inanimate object for an action, but it doesn't solve the issues.  People who break laws are not going to really care about breaking another.  But enjoy those blinders if it makes you feel warm and fuzzy.  8)

In the words of Robert A. Heinlein - "an armed society is a polite society."
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dee-Vo on January 15, 2019, 09:43:27 AM
Sadly enough, you can't fill a room with toddlers and knives and expect to blame the toddler for the impending accidents.

The world is full of people who are cold, uncaring, spiteful, and mean. Unfortunately, they always will be.

There are times when you must look past what you believe to see that what you believe isn't always the correct action to take. Everyone cannot be correct.

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 15, 2019, 10:07:49 AM
Quote from: Big J on January 15, 2019, 09:01:01 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 14, 2019, 19:47:34 PM
J, your verbiage reminded me of the nonsensical saying, "If I had ham, I'd have ham and eggs, if I had eggs". 

With my blinders securely on, I know that the U.S. is the top civilian gun-owning country, and in the U.S. over 60% of homicides are gun related, and we, good old America, are either #1 or around #11 in mass shootings (depending on the inclusion of rate per population).  Plus, you must admit we do have absolute ease in obtaining firearms.   Tightening and adjusting those little side blinkers, scrutinizing those numbers, the facts, I have come to the conclusion we have a gun problem, because, with conviction, I am sure we don't have a greater number of crazies in this country over other civilized nations. 

Peace, you bunch of Moloch-gun-loving peckerwoods (Leviticus 18.21, 20.1-5 for the biblically challenged).  I am open for inducement on our number of crazies, if anyone is interested.

I'm really not sure how guns are easy to obtain.  Have to go through a background check whether you buy them at gun store, gun show, or interwebs.  Only way to not go through a background check is in private transactions and the seller is required by law to authenticate they are not selling to a felon or a person prohibited from purchasing firearms.  Liability falls on seller. 

Issue is people believe firearms are the issue when it is people.  Take Britian for example.  You have police confiscating butter knives from people and toting it as "another knife off the street".  You can always blame an inanimate object for an action, but it doesn't solve the issues.  People who break laws are not going to really care about breaking another.  But enjoy those blinders if it makes you feel warm and fuzzy.  8)

In the words of Robert A. Heinlein - "an armed society is a polite society."


Heinlein's stories are wonderful fiction, with no poverty and the quote is cute, and looks great on a t-shirt at the local gun show.   

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/03/02/world/international-gun-laws.html 

Obtaining is easy compared to others. 

If our "issue" is our "people", please tell me how our people are different from other earthly inhabitants and what inanimate objects do our people have access to that others may not.   So, I think what you're saying is we (US) might have more crazies than our world colleagues.   

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 15, 2019, 10:18:41 AM
HeinLein did more than fiction.

And are you saying violence and shootings do not happen in other countries? Is this the argument I need to disprove? Violent crimes in other countries happen at the same rate or higher than in the US. Sure, there may be less shootings, but look at bombings, vehicles running over people, etc. Heck, China has a guy go bonkers and stab a couple dozen people pretty regularly.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-26402367 (https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-26402367)

http://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/26/world/asia/china-kindergarten-stabbing.amp.html (http://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/26/world/asia/china-kindergarten-stabbing.amp.html)

And the point that it is easier to get a gun in the US than countries that do not allow guns or have massive restrictions seems like a dumb argument too. Sure, we have freedom here. The point?  Bad people do bad things. Stopping good people from having things does not negate bad people doing bad things. Especially in what you are restricting is a tool that is effective In Stopping said bad person.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 15, 2019, 10:42:14 AM
Quote from: Big J on January 15, 2019, 10:18:41 AMHeinLein
Quote from: Big J on January 15, 2019, 10:18:41 AMHeinLein did more than fiction. And are you saying violence and shootings do not happen in other countries? Is this the argument I need to disprove? Violent crimes in other countries happen at the same rate or higher than in the US. Sure, there may be less shootings, but look at bombings, vehicles running over people, etc. Heck, China has a guy go bonkers and stab a couple dozen people pretty regularly. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-26402367 (https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-26402367) http://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/26/world/asia/china-kindergarten-stabbing.amp.html (http://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/26/world/asia/china-kindergarten-stabbing.amp.html) And the point that it is easier to get a gun in the US than countries that do not allow guns or have massive restrictions seems like a dumb argument too. Sure, we have freedom here. The point?  Bad people do bad things. Stopping good people from having things does not negate bad people doing bad things. Especially in what you are restricting is a tool that is effective In Stopping said bad person.

Sorry, enlighten me on Heinlein's non-fiction, non-science fiction works. 

You're the one that was unsure how guns are easy to obtain here in the U.S.  "I'm really not sure how guns are easy to obtain."

You are correct; we may not have more violent crime than other developed nations.  We have more guns. 


https://www.vox.com/2015/8/27/9217163/america-guns-europe (https://www.vox.com/2015/8/27/9217163/america-guns-europe)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on January 15, 2019, 11:03:01 AM
You guys may as well accept the fact that you're never going to win an argument with Muddy no matter the topic  b'; If you call a lump of coal black he will respond with the observation that because it was originally in the ground and therefore likely has some remnants of color from the soil. He'll even provide a link to prove his point.

His background as a biology professor indicates he has a scientific mind but was likely reading the panties and bra section of Sears & Roebuck catalog out in the outhouse when they were passing out common sense.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 15, 2019, 12:02:16 PM
Quote from: Al on January 15, 2019, 11:03:01 AM
You guys may as well accept the fact that you're never going to win an argument with Muddy no matter the topic  b'; If you call a lump of coal black he will respond with the observation that because it was originally in the ground and therefore likely has some remnants of color from the soil. He'll even provide a link to prove his point.

His background as a biology professor indicates he has a scientific mind but was likely reading the panties and bra section of Sears & Roebuck catalog out in the outhouse when they were passing out common sense.

Al, you are still my pal.  You give me a good laugh and I remain infatuated with your lovely wife.

But you are only somewhat correct.  I've lost many arguments with the Mrs. and I was not "reading" the bra and panties section; I was looking at the photos.   I did not learn to read until the 8th grade. 

Now you guys go clean your damned guns and masturbate to the poster of the late Charlton Heston!

Peace guys – it has been a hoot.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 15, 2019, 12:21:50 PM


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Way ahead of you Mudwall.  Just put some rounds thru this CZ 2075 on my lunch break.   /'/

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: 22midge on January 15, 2019, 14:29:49 PM
how long did it take you to punch that many holes with a pencil ?     ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Beetle on January 15, 2019, 20:17:15 PM
Where do ISIS and the Taliban fit into the gun debate?



Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dougfish on January 15, 2019, 21:42:04 PM
Quote from: Beetle on January 15, 2019, 20:17:15 PM
Where do ISIS and the Taliban fit into the gun debate?

We really need to go camping and fishing again.
Maybe we'll clean a gun. Or ten.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 16, 2019, 11:20:31 AM
Quote from: Beetle on January 15, 2019, 20:17:15 PM
Where do ISIS and the Taliban fit into the gun debate?

A better question might be--- where do the Russians fit into our gun debate?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 16, 2019, 12:42:32 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 16, 2019, 11:20:31 AM
Quote from: Beetle on January 15, 2019, 20:17:15 PM
Where do ISIS and the Taliban fit into the gun debate?

A better question might be--- where do the Russians fit into our gun debate?


CZ is a Czechoslovakia designed gun.  It was part of Eastern Bloc.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Beetle on January 16, 2019, 15:51:05 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 16, 2019, 11:20:31 AM
Quote from: Beetle on January 15, 2019, 20:17:15 PM
Where do ISIS and the Taliban fit into the gun debate?

A better question might be--- where do the Russians fit into our gun debate?

Deflecting is beneath you.   Answer the question
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 16, 2019, 16:40:31 PM
Quote from: Beetle on January 16, 2019, 15:51:05 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 16, 2019, 11:20:31 AM
Quote from: Beetle on January 15, 2019, 20:17:15 PM
Where do ISIS and the Taliban fit into the gun debate?

A better question might be--- where do the Russians fit into our gun debate?

Deflecting is beneath you.   Answer the question

OK, it seems the Taliban and ISIS would prefer we keep producing weapons and scattering them all over the globe.

https://www.wired.com/story/terror-industrial-complex-isis-munitions-supply-chain/

https://thediplomat.com/2018/06/how-the-us-is-indirectly-arming-the-taliban/
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Onslow on January 16, 2019, 18:44:10 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 16, 2019, 11:20:31 AM
Quote from: Beetle on January 15, 2019, 20:17:15 PM
Where do ISIS and the Taliban fit into the gun debate?

A better question might be--- where do the Russians fit into our gun debate?

I don't know.  Do you know if they fit? If they do, please explain how.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 16, 2019, 19:02:17 PM
Quote from: Onslow on January 16, 2019, 18:44:10 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 16, 2019, 11:20:31 AM
Quote from: Beetle on January 15, 2019, 20:17:15 PM
Where do ISIS and the Taliban fit into the gun debate?

A better question might be--- where do the Russians fit into our gun debate?

I don't know.  Do you know if they fit? If they do, please explain how.


We let the Russian redhead infiltrate our NRA.  Someone must have thought it was a proper fit.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/russian-agents-guilty-plea-intensifies-spotlight-on-relationship-with-nra/2018/12/13/e6569a00-fe26-11e8-862a-b6a6f3ce8199_story.html?noredirect=on

https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2018/12/19/why-russia-sees-nra-key-manipulating-american-politics/?utm_term=.93199419bc5a
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: croaker on January 16, 2019, 19:26:26 PM
More homicides by abortion than guns?

http://www.idahocountyfreepress.com/news/2018/may/16/shocked-deaths-guns-vs-abortion/
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on January 16, 2019, 19:52:41 PM
I'll stay out of the politics. I have guns, carry a gun, practice with them, and will use them to protect myself and family if necessary. The country (and the world in general) is rapidly falling apart, I fear.  A general breakdown of society is a real possibility. There's not a damn thing I can really do about it.  b';
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: JMiller on January 21, 2019, 19:15:46 PM
My beloved Browning Gold Hunter was in action this weekend.

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When I got home and tore her down, couldn't believe the mess inside. Few days dragging through the mud will do it. She fired like a champ all weekend. Pinners!!!
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on March 08, 2019, 19:52:57 PM
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Went to the range today. Sighted in a red dot for the Ruger PC9. Took the pistols out too. Really liking these CZ’s. Fit my hand extremely well and point perfectly for me. Also put another 100 rounds through the P365 and was flawless.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on March 12, 2019, 17:00:27 PM
If you were thinking about boycotting Dicks for their stand on guns, think no more

https://www.wsj.com/articles/dicks-sporting-goods-to-remove-guns-from-125-stores-11552400663
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dougfish on March 12, 2019, 19:19:13 PM
I couldn't give a shit about guns.
I don't shop Dicks because they're dicks. The same for Walmart. And Bed, Bath and Beyond.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on March 13, 2019, 06:29:40 AM
I hope Dick’s goes out of business like Gander did and comes back better like Gander did. Gander actually has good prices now. My favorite thing about the Dick’s CEO is how he pissed on a big part of it’s base with his holier than thou mentality and than is confused why his sales isn’t coming back.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on March 13, 2019, 09:29:35 AM
I don't give a rat's ass what Dick's does or doesn't sell. That's their business. I'm going to the range to practice moving/drawing/firing right now. I have guns and ammo from other stores.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on March 13, 2019, 09:58:53 AM
Quote from: Phil on March 13, 2019, 09:29:35 AMI don't give a rat's ass what Dick's does or doesn't sell. That's their business. I'm going to the range to practice moving/drawing/firing right now. I have guns and ammo from other stores.

I didn't care when Dick's pulled their AR-15 from floor (twice).  I didn't care when they decided to sell to only 21 yo's.  I don't care they are pulling guns from their stores.  This is what pissed me off.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-05-03/dick-s-sporting-goods-ramps-up-gun-control-push-hires-lobbyist (https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-05-03/dick-s-sporting-goods-ramps-up-gun-control-push-hires-lobbyist)

For some reason the media articles recently are failing to mention the real reason for the boycott.  It's the lobbyist on their payroll pushing anti 2A laws. 

Screw them and their overpriced crap.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on March 13, 2019, 10:15:57 AM
It’s been so long since I’ve been in a Dick’s that I forgot they sold guns.  I don’t know if their CEO was acknowledging moral superiority with the decision to not sell firearms.  Heck, others have acted similarly or were “holier than thou” from the beginning.   CVS removed all tobacco products and Tumblr banned all porn.

If I owned an ‘outdoor’ store, I wouldn’t sell firearms --- wouldn’t want to deal with all the peckerheads wanting to talk guns, boast/fib about their accuracy and performance â€" like this 41 page thread, which no one has to read, but if you operated an establishment you’d be forced to hear it regularly.   
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Woolly Bugger on March 13, 2019, 10:25:10 AM
Dick's is changing it's business and realigning it's products and heavily investing in e-store to compete in a changing social environment. I have no beef with their decision not to sell guns in some of their stores, they started with 10 and now added another 125 more out of over 700 stores... 

There are plenty of other retailers willing to take their gun customers... Dunham's for one, will sell you guns all day long.....

Have you been in a Dick's lately... to me it's focus is soccer, golf, exercise, clothing with a little bit of camping, fishing and hunting thrown in to round out the field...
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Woolly Bugger on March 13, 2019, 10:26:06 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on March 13, 2019, 10:15:57 AMand Tumblr banned all porn.

wait, how did you know about that?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on March 13, 2019, 10:43:55 AM
Quote from: Woolly Bugger on March 13, 2019, 10:26:06 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on March 13, 2019, 10:15:57 AMand Tumblr banned all porn.

wait, how did you know about that?

My wife told me.  She was pissed.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Beetle on March 13, 2019, 12:28:11 PM
 [/quote]
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on March 13, 2019, 10:15:57 AMIt’s been so long since I’ve been in a Dick’s that I forgot they sold guns.  I don’t know if their CEO was acknowledging moral superiority with the decision to not sell firearms.  Heck, others have acted similarly or were “holier than thou” from the beginning.   CVS removed all tobacco products and Tumblr banned all porn.

If I owned an ‘outdoor’ store, I wouldn’t sell firearms --- wouldn’t want to deal with all the peckerheads wanting to talk guns, boast/fib about their accuracy and performance â€" like this 41 page thread, which no one has to read, but if you operated an establishment you’d be forced to hear it regularly.   


 'c;    'c;    'c;    'c;    'c;    'c;    'c;
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Woolly Bugger on March 13, 2019, 17:10:41 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on March 13, 2019, 10:15:57 AMIt’s been so long since I’ve been in a Dick’s that I forgot they sold guns.  I don’t know if their CEO was acknowledging moral superiority with the decision to not sell firearms.  Heck, others have acted similarly or were “holier than thou” from the beginning.   CVS removed all tobacco products and Tumblr banned all porn.

If I owned an ‘outdoor’ store, I wouldn’t sell firearms --- wouldn’t want to deal with all the peckerheads wanting to talk guns, boast/fib about their accuracy and performance â€" like this 41 page thread, which no one has to read, but if you operated an establishment you’d be forced to hear it regularly.   


 'c;    'c;    'c;    'c;    'c;    'c;    'c;
[/quote]

Not to mention keeping up all the government paperwork and nightly gun counts
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: driver on March 13, 2019, 20:07:56 PM
My cousin owns a gun shop. These past couple of years, every time I go in I ask, "How business?" his reply, "Slow".. I then tell him it wasn't me that elected a Republican president! Then he grumbles about liberals, and I remind him how much money he made when the president was a democrat.

Please don't take this post into a political discussion. It's just a funny banter we have. And it's funny how ironic the situation is. And the overall point is that gun sales are also way down right now. No fear of losing them.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on March 14, 2019, 06:59:23 AM
Quote from: driver on March 13, 2019, 20:07:56 PMMy cousin owns a gun shop. These past couple of years, every time I go in I ask, "How business?" his reply, "Slow".. I then tell him it wasn't me that elected a Republican president! Then he grumbles about liberals, and I remind him how much money he made when the president was a democrat.

Please don't take this post into a political discussion. It's just a funny banter we have. And it's funny how ironic the situation is. And the overall point is that gun sales are also way down right now. No fear of losing them.

Yup. A president that is viewed as gun friendly is bad for gun sales. Obama was the best gun salesmen to date. Ironically, I think Trump has been more detrimental to the 2nd than Obama was, but that is getting political.

The gun shop I frequent has been slow but they made a killing in past election and Obama years that I think they aren’t hurting. Plus they know 2020 is right around the corner.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on March 14, 2019, 10:48:41 AM
The gun shop I deal with, located across the WV line, is doing very well.  The owner often must order firearms, but the 3 I’ve purchased quickly arrived.  As said, that is WV, and in WV they are always shooting something, no matter who is President.

I believe our founding fathers suggested we evaluate and modify the Constitution every ~20 years.   20 yrs because that was the life expectancy at the time  --- for white men only.    Now we live until age ~77.  Either period, we’re overdue.  It is time to weigh and modify the 2nd to reflect developments/attitudes in present-day society, environment, and science.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on March 14, 2019, 10:55:27 AM
Not to move the topic off topic, but how do you purchase firearms in WV being a VA resident?  You'd have to get them transferred to a VA FFL before being transferred to you.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on March 14, 2019, 11:07:50 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on March 14, 2019, 10:48:41 AMThe gun shop I deal with, located across the WV line, is doing very well.  The owner often must order firearms, but the 3 I’ve purchased quickly arrived.  As said, that is WV, and in WV they are always shooting something, no matter who is President.

I believe our founding fathers suggested we evaluate and modify the Constitution every ~20 years.   20 yrs because that was the life expectancy at the time  --- for white men only.    Now we live until age ~77.  Either period, we’re overdue.  It is time to weigh and modify the 2nd to reflect developments/attitudes in present-day society, environment, and science.


I heartily disagree.

First off, cite your source(s) for life expectancy for the era when the Constitution was written.  I believe you are off significantly.

The founding fathers put a process in place to prevent the evisceration the Constitution and the Bill of Rights by requiring a 2/3's majority to ratify an amendment to the Constitution. 

Even at that, we have made at least one colossal mistake that was repealed.

Go ahead, evaluate all of the amendments and tell me which ones of them should be changed.  Or tell me if you would add any others.

Then tell me how you guarantee we enforce any of them as citizens.

Raymond



Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on March 14, 2019, 11:16:54 AM
Quote from: Big J on March 14, 2019, 10:55:27 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on March 14, 2019, 10:48:41 AMThe gun shop I deal with, located across the WV line, is doing very well.  The owner often must order firearms, but the 3 I’ve purchased quickly arrived.  As said, that is WV, and in WV they are always shooting something, no matter who is President.

I believe our founding fathers suggested we evaluate and modify the Constitution every ~20 years.  20 yrs because that was the life expectancy at the time  --- for white men only.    Now we live until age ~77.  Either period, we’re overdue.  It is time to weigh and modify the 2nd to reflect developments/attitudes in present-day society, environment, and science.


Not to move the topic off topic, but how do you purchase firearms in WV being a VA resident?  You'd have to get them transferred to a VA FFL before being transferred to you.

Damned if I know, but I’ve done it 3 times since I retired in 2016.  Several folks that live along the state line purchase firearms in WV  --- no pistols but hunting firearms.  I complete paperwork, wait for some kind of check, then pick up my gun.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on March 14, 2019, 11:42:39 AM
Quote from: rbphoto on March 14, 2019, 11:07:50 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on March 14, 2019, 10:48:41 AMThe gun shop I deal with, located across the WV line, is doing very well.  The owner often must order firearms, but the 3 I’ve purchased quickly arrived.  As said, that is WV, and in WV they are always shooting something, no matter who is President.

I believe our founding fathers suggested we evaluate and modify the Constitution every ~20 years.  20 yrs because that was the life expectancy at the time  --- for white men only.    Now we live until age ~77.  Either period, we’re overdue.  It is time to weigh and modify the 2nd to reflect developments/attitudes in present-day society, environment, and science.


I heartily disagree.

First off, cite your source(s) for life expectancy for the era when the Constitution was written.  I believe you are off significantly.

The founding fathers put a process in place to prevent the evisceration the Constitution and the Bill of Rights by requiring a 2/3's majority to ratify an amendment to the Constitution. 

Even at that, we have made at least one colossal mistake that was repealed.

Go ahead, evaluate all of the amendments and tell me which ones of them should be changed.  Or tell me if you would add any others.

Then tell me how you guarantee we enforce any of them as citizens.

Raymond





I had no idea where I got the 20 years.  It was something I remembered or thought I recalled.  I was off after checking your premise that I was incorrect.

http://virginiahistoryseries.org/linked/unit%206.%20life.growth.development%20of%20va%20colony.slides.pdf

“Disease and hardships took their toll of emigrants & native-born Virginians alike. If children lived past 20, their life expectancy was about 40; but, many children didn’t survive into adulthood.”

I happen to believe we do not need (or no longer need) firearms to “enforce any of them as citizens”.  I also do not fear ‘the man’ confiscating my guns.  I have no fear of registering my firearms.  I don’t believe we will ever be barred from purchasing or limited access to ‘hunting’ arms.  In short, government(s)/societal rule or changes do not occupy my feelings or worries. 

Sure, I’d enjoy playing with, shooting, certain firearms that fire multiple rounds in seconds, but I long ago came to terms that my dick was small and no purchase of or playing with inanimate objects would change or improve my manhood.
 
My biggest fear is I’ll one day succumb to that human trait, the lack of critical thinking, because of the evolutionary gift bestowed on all of us, that talent for being deceived and the subsequent paranoia.
 
Stephen
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on March 14, 2019, 11:57:44 AM
We might want to delete some of the comments here.  Out of state firearm purchases have to go through an in state FFL.  Doesn't matter if it is a private transaction, a gun shop, hunting rifles, or an old flintlock.  Being your neck of the woods, and the part of WV you are close to, I'm not sure what happened.  I doubt a WV gun shop could obtain a VA FFL.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on March 14, 2019, 12:00:39 PM
https://www.durysguns.com/news/gun-transfer-laws-buying-out-of-state (https://www.durysguns.com/news/gun-transfer-laws-buying-out-of-state)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on March 14, 2019, 14:05:19 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on March 14, 2019, 11:42:39 AMI had no idea where I got the 20 years.  It was something I remembered or thought I recalled.  I was off after checking your premise that I was incorrect.

http://virginiahistoryseries.org/linked/unit%206.%20life.growth.development%20of%20va%20colony.slides.pdf

“Disease and hardships took their toll of emigrants & native-born Virginians alike. If children lived past 20, their life expectancy was about 40; but, many children didn’t survive into adulthood.”

I happen to believe we do not need (or no longer need) firearms to “enforce any of them as citizens”.  I also do not fear ‘the man’ confiscating my guns.  I have no fear of registering my firearms.  I don’t believe we will ever be barred from purchasing or limited access to ‘hunting’ arms.  In short, government(s)/societal rule or changes do not occupy my feelings or worries. 

Sure, I’d enjoy playing with, shooting, certain firearms that fire multiple rounds in seconds, but I long ago came to terms that my dick was small and no purchase of or playing with inanimate objects would change or improve my manhood.
 
My biggest fear is I’ll one day succumb to that human trait, the lack of critical thinking, because of the evolutionary gift bestowed on all of us, that talent for being deceived and the subsequent paranoia.
 
Stephen

I don't buy in to the Freudian psychology that you seem to, so my penis size really doesn't come into play regarding my affinity for firearms. 

You still only answered part of the question and conveniently avoided any coherent conversation regarding the evaluation of the Constitution and/or Bill of Rights.

You also, conveniently, dismissed only a single methodology for ensuring that the rights of the citizens of the US are protected.

I never stated I believed any of our 2nd amendment rights would be infringed.

Raymond
who is going shooting this afternoon and all weekend long, so I'll see y'all Monday.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on March 14, 2019, 14:14:37 PM
Quote from: Big J on March 14, 2019, 11:57:44 AMWe might want to delete some of the comments here.  Out of state firearm purchases have to go through an in state FFL.  Doesn't matter if it is a private transaction, a gun shop, hunting rifles, or an old flintlock.  Being your neck of the woods, and the part of WV you are close to, I'm not sure what happened.  I doubt a WV gun shop could obtain a VA FFL.

See this bullshit is what I am talking about â€" paranoia where there should be no worries.  Damn J, reading is fundamental!

“You can buy a rifle in another state as long as the sale is legal in both states. Assuming both states are okay with it, you can buy a rifle or a shotgun from an FFL in another state. Out of state handguns have to go through an FFL in your state.”

https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/buying-an-out-of-state-gun-in-person.296599/

“Buying Out of State. Federal firearms license (FFL) holders are the only persons who can legally handle gun sales across state lines. This means that the merchant you’re buying from must have an FFL, and that seller must, we repeat, must, ship the weapon directly to an FFL holder in your state.”

“Federal firearms license (FFL) holders are the only persons who can legally handle gun sales across state lines.”

https://www.durysguns.com/news/gun-transfer-laws-buying-out-of-state


This is exactly what the gun shop owner told me (same as above).  He has a  FFL, a Federal license and can sell long guns across state line, but handguns must go through the resident’s state FFL.
 
Plus, is there an animal like VA FFL, and individual state FFL?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on March 14, 2019, 14:26:48 PM
Quote from: rbphoto on March 14, 2019, 14:05:19 PMRaymond
who is going shooting this afternoon and all weekend long, so I'll see y'all Monday.

Be sure to bring a pencil or the correct sized dowel to make those posted holes.  Be safe.

Stephen

I’m going to shoot this weekend as well â€" bought 3 boxes of tungsten loads for my 20 turkey gun, at $6 per shell.  See I can be deceived as well.  The new loads may pattern out to 60 yards, but I still got screwed by the firearms/ammo industry at $6 each.   

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on March 14, 2019, 14:30:50 PM
Well I'll be.  I learned something new today about guns from frickin Hiner.  That sure is a poorly clarified and under highlighted law on the ATF's website.  Handguns have to go FFL to FFL, but long guns can go FFL to out of state resident. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dougfish on March 14, 2019, 17:54:15 PM
Go fishing. It's cheaper, assholes.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on March 14, 2019, 18:55:36 PM
It's cheaper if ya use crappy old fiberglass rods....  d:b
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dougfish on March 14, 2019, 19:42:27 PM
Genius. Phil knows, how Doug flows.
I have 3 rods for every box of Mudwall's shells. And they don't break.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on March 18, 2019, 08:18:24 AM
Quote from: Dougfish on March 14, 2019, 17:54:15 PMGo fishing. It's cheaper, assholes.

And, unlike sporting clays (where I really care if I don't hit everything I shoot at), I just enjoy fishing for fishing.

On the other hand, everybody in the South Carolina State Sporting Clays Championship this past weekend are simply in awe over a 15 yr old winning the tournament.

And, to top that off, he shot two turkeys Saturday afternoon on youth day!

Raymond
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on March 20, 2019, 08:53:18 AM
Raymond’s photo of the fish-printed scatter gun in lurker thread jogged my memory --- what do you turkey hunters and shooters think about this combination?  301 TURKEY .410 w/ HEAVYWEIGHT® TSS turkey loads?  301 made in PRC, which I think means China -- I could be wrong.

https://www.savagearms.com/firearms/shotgun/stevens-series/301-turkey

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on March 20, 2019, 11:15:27 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on March 20, 2019, 08:53:18 AMRaymond’s photo of the fish-printed scatter gun in lurker thread jogged my memory --- what do you turkey hunters and shooters think about this combination?  301 TURKEY .410 w/ HEAVYWEIGHT® TSS turkey loads?  301 made in PRC, which I think means China -- I could be wrong.

https://www.savagearms.com/firearms/shotgun/stevens-series/301-turkey


I used to think the .410 was a tool for only very close, light game.

About a year ago I saw a friend of mine break a clay target that was 70+ yards away and easily 50' high with a .410 with an improved cylinder choke . . .

I probably wouldn't use the gun pictured above for turkey hunting, but I would take a shot at a turkey within 30 yds with the right ammo and the right choke . . .
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: bmadd on March 20, 2019, 14:12:28 PM
These TSS loads do seem to make the .410 a formidable scatter gun out to 40 yards for turkeys. Like you, I bought some for my 20 as well. Hoping to pattern a few this weekend before season opens.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: driver on March 20, 2019, 18:36:41 PM
Can use a rifle for turkey in Va or WV? I got one of those savage ,222 over 20ga i need to get rid of.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on March 21, 2019, 08:32:12 AM
Fast action.  What do you think?

https://politicalwire.com/2019/03/21/new-zealand-swiftly-bans-assault-weapons/
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on March 21, 2019, 09:37:19 AM
I'm tired and probably shouldn't be constructing sentences right now, but I'll take a stab at it.

My takeaways.

1) I'm not really surprised and it'll go through like the Australia gun buyback with little resistance. 

2) It is sad from a historic firearms collection standpoint.  New Zealand was one of the few countries you could own full auto weapons that were unmodified with original markings.  A lot of old world war firearms as a result ended up in New Zealand in private collections.  There were obviously strict laws for owning them even to the point of you couldn't own ammunition in the same caliber of those full auto weapons.  We'll see what the final wording of legislation is, but from the looks of it, they will be destroyed.  Would at least like to see them end up in a museum.

3) New Zealand is playing right into this fascist's goals.  He even stated in his manifesto that he could of chosen any number of methods to kill and methods that would of caused way more death, but selected the AR-15 to cause as much global chaos as possible.  Said it would cause issues in the US and erode the 2A, cause political strife, and create bans of freedoms currently granted. 


4) If you want to compare New Zealand's action to an evil person's acts of violence to what the US should do, you are comparing apples and oranges.  NZ doesn't have a right to firearms under their constitution.  They are an island nation with no neighboring countries and low population.  On top of that, the US would not willingly give up semi auto rifles.  It is to engrained into society and if foundational to the Constitution.  The whole point of the 2A is to prevent a tyrannical government.  A Republic is not a forever solution in my opinion and the founder's opinions and the 2A was a safeguard to allow the Republic to go on as long as possible.  And before you say "but but but you are saying AR-15's are going to defeat the government and military?" and believe you should look at moral, cases like arming citizens in civil war in proxy wars (Afghanistan vs Russia is a good example), or even in the US the Battle of Athens (really good read). 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on March 21, 2019, 10:01:58 AM
"They who can give up essential Liberty to obtain a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." - Benjamin Franklin
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on April 03, 2019, 12:39:43 PM
Today's quick range trip. 45 rounds quick fired -- 30 (4 mags) at 10 yards, 15 (2 mags) at 15 yards.
Two misses. Durn.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dougfish on April 03, 2019, 14:45:20 PM
Phil dangerous.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Woolly Bugger on April 03, 2019, 14:46:54 PM
Quote from: Dougfish on April 03, 2019, 14:45:20 PMPhil B. dangerous.

fixed
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on May 17, 2019, 11:26:50 AM

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Ran some rounds through the CZ 75 and Sig P365.  Around the 1,200 round mark on the P365 and still no issues.  Been carrying it more and more.  The CZ 75 is easily my favorite handgun to shoot.  It fits my hand like perfection.  Natural draw and point for me and quick follow up shots due to weight of all steel frame.  My Glock 19 may be going bye bye soon for another CZ.  Jus Sayin. 

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on May 22, 2019, 12:13:06 PM
Came across this the other day --

Why I Carry a Gun

I don't carry a gun to kill people; I carry a gun to keep from being killed.

I don't carry a gun because I'm evil; I carry a gun because I have lived long enough to see the evil in the World.

I don't carry a gun because I hate the government; I carry a gun because I understand the limitations of government.

I don't carry a gun because I'm angry; I carry a gun so that I don't have to spend the rest of my life hating myself for failing to be prepared.

I don't carry a gun because I want to shoot someone; I carry a gun because I want to die at a ripe old age in my bed and not on a sidewalk somewhere tomorrow afternoon.

I don't carry a gun to make me feel like a man; I carry a gun because men know how to take care of themselves and the ones they love.

I don't carry a gun because I feel inadequate; I carry a gun because unarmed and facing three armed thugs, I am inadequate.

I don't carry a gun because I love it; I carry a gun because I love life and the people who make it meaningful to me.

I carry a gun because I'm too young to die and too old to take a whoopin' without dying.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on May 22, 2019, 15:40:26 PM
Quote from: Phil on May 22, 2019, 12:13:06 PMCame across this the other day --

Why I Carry a Gun

I don't carry a gun to kill people; I carry a gun to keep from being killed.

................................


Counterpoints:

This reasoning makes sense to me but I am guilty of being a puss, sometimes.

"Why I Don't Own a Handgun"
"I don't want to live in fear. I know that sounds strange — a gun is supposed to bring peace of mind. But to keep a piece at your side is to look at the world through gunsights. It's a profoundly anti-social posture. To me, carrying a handgun is an acknowledgement of weakness, not strength. It's an admission that you're out of ideas for how to deal with people, even those — especially those — who mean you harm. It's a failure of imagination, a failure of wits and, in the case of open carry, a threat of violence to every passing person."


I guess I am often weak, and out of ideas on how to deal with coyotes, bears, and those damned invisible mountain lions, because I carry a handgun in the woods. 

https://www.texasobserver.org/why-i-dont-own-a-handgun/
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Onslow on May 22, 2019, 18:29:08 PM
I don't give a damn about getting killed. Humans are conceived, live a few happy moments, then die.

I'm too damn lazy to carry.  Don't care about living in fear.  If someone gets in my grill, I'll bite their nose off.

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on May 22, 2019, 18:44:35 PM
Quote from: Onslow on May 22, 2019, 18:29:08 PMI don't give a damn about getting killed. Humans are conceived, live a few happy moments, then die.

I'm too damn lazy to carry.  Don't care about living in fear.  If someone gets in my grill, I'll bite their nose off.



I don't live in fear. Gotta question though -- you ever been shot? Ever had someone shooting at you? I have. Getting shot really hurts. Hard to bite somebody's nose off if they're shooting at you or holding a gun on you.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on May 28, 2019, 08:11:15 AM
I really do get both sides of the coin.  Carrying is not for everyone.  Guns aren't for everyone.  Believe that decision should be made by an individual though. Now that I have a wife and two girls it scares the living daylights out of me knowing the kinds of people that walk among us.  That story about Jayme Closs scares me.  Random stranger finds a random girl getting off bus and decides to go in and murder the whole family and kidnap the girl.  Sure, having a gun on you at all times or in the house isn't a guaranteed measure of security, but I know it sure makes me feel better out in public with family or at sleep at night.  Humans are flawed beings.  There are some people out in society that are not "fixable".  I try and stay optimistic and give everyone the benefit of the doubt, but I prefer a to walk with a big stick just incase. I admit I am weak.  There is millions of people that can kick my rear end to Timbuktu and back.  If there is a life and death situation for my girls or someone who is weaker, I'd like to have every advantage within reason at my disposal.  When my girls are of age, I hope to instill the same in them.  Except for my wife, she can't be trusted with a gun.  Or wasp spray.  Or a butter knife.  I can't tell you how many times me or the girls have about been sprayed in the face with wasp spray because a bee or wasp got too close to my wife. Like I said, guns aren't for everyone. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Yallerhammer on May 28, 2019, 09:28:44 AM
Quote from: Onslow on May 22, 2019, 18:29:08 PMI don't give a damn about getting killed. Humans are conceived, live a few happy moments, then die.

I'm too damn lazy to carry.  Don't care about living in fear.  If someone gets in my grill, I'll bite their nose off.



I do give a damn about getting killed.  I like it here for the most part. I care even more about my family staying alive.

I don't care for living in naivety or victimhood. I carry every day, pretty much everywhere. And hopefully never need it. But if I do, I'm not limited to biting.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: JMiller on May 29, 2019, 05:46:44 AM
I'd rather drink than carry.
Sorry.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on May 29, 2019, 16:38:22 PM
Quote from: JMiller on May 29, 2019, 05:46:44 AMI'd rather drink than carry.
Sorry.

I agree that is one downside to a CCP but I look at it this way while in a public place - I probably shouldn't be drinking anyway because I will have to drive home and the last thing I need is a DUI. Another thought is O'douls and the other  non-alcoholic beers taste almost the same to me so when out in public I often drink them.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on June 20, 2019, 07:54:45 AM


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Glock 19 went bye bye and sold a couple other guns and got this CZ P-01 with a Cajun Gun Works Pro Kit.  These CZ's may be hipster like but they sure do fit my hand nicely.   


Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on June 20, 2019, 18:24:38 PM
Very sweet. /'/
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on July 08, 2019, 15:38:57 PM
Time to bump this one to the top again :o

https://reason.com/2019/07/08/noncompliance-kneecaps-new-zealands-gun-control-scheme/
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on July 09, 2019, 08:33:13 AM
Quote from: Al on July 08, 2019, 15:38:57 PMTime to bump this one to the top again :o

https://reason.com/2019/07/08/noncompliance-kneecaps-new-zealands-gun-control-scheme/


Yup, everyone talks about Australia's buyback. You ever see the photos of them destroying the guns from the Australian Buyback? Everyone gave up their antique shotguns, muskets, and bolt guns.  Very few "assault" weapons were handed over. 

Also, VA has a heaping pile of crap that would even make California and New York blush.

http://lis.virginia.gov/cgi-bin/legp604.exe?192+sum+HB4021&utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app (http://lis.virginia.gov/cgi-bin/legp604.exe?192+sum+HB4021&utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app)

I'm thinking it doesn't have a chance to pass, but they are trying.  My guess is they are using this as a bargaining chip to get other legislation passed.  Than the "republicans" will vote for the other garbage bills and say "see, we defeated the "assault weapons" ban".  I believe the government of this state hasn't taken a look at the Virginia flag and what it represents lately.....
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: driver on July 09, 2019, 11:28:09 AM
So I currently can carry a shotgun with a 20 round drum in public places in VA?

I can picture myself in line at the grocery store with a Saiga 12 slung over my shoulder. "Ma'm, will you hold my street sweeper while I get my wallett?"

I still kick myself in the ass for never buying a Saiga 12.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on July 09, 2019, 18:23:28 PM
Quote from: driver on July 09, 2019, 11:28:09 AMSo I currently can carry a shotgun with a 20 round drum in public places in VA?

I can picture myself in line at the grocery store with a Saiga 12 slung over my shoulder. "Ma'm, will you hold my street sweeper while I get my wallett?"

I still kick myself in the ass for never buying a Saiga 12.

If you wanted too I guess. Texas has people walking around with AR-15's and AK 47's to show how stupid it was they couldn't carry a spring assisted knife.

Also good luck finding a saiga under $1,500. Those things skyrocketed after the import ban. There should be some USA made ones on the market now if I remember correctly.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on July 24, 2019, 16:13:54 PM
Today on an open IDPA range -- this is draw and fire 3-5 round quick volley, holster, move, draw, repeat -- moving from 7 yards to 15 yards, quick stance. 8" target. I had some flyers, and not great patterns, but this ain't standing in one place and taking slow aim....

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on July 24, 2019, 19:54:17 PM
Good shooting Phil  bd;0  'c;  bd;0  'c;  bd;0  'c;  -  I did those drills on a frequent basis back when I fooled around playing police officer. Not easy and lots of pressure. I need to do some of those shoot and move exercises again.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dougfish on July 24, 2019, 20:47:39 PM
Euro shooting.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on July 25, 2019, 06:22:51 AM
Quote from: Phil on July 24, 2019, 16:13:54 PMToday on an open IDPA range -- this is draw and fire 3-5 round quick volley, holster, move, draw, repeat -- moving from 7 yards to 15 yards, quick stance. 8" target. I had some flyers, and not great patterns, but this ain't standing in one place and taking slow aim....

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Not bad at all. I've contemplated getting into some of those matches as I need a lot of practice, but always convince myself I don't need another hobby. Scott (consumnfire) got into those matches but think he stopped when kids came along.

Which gun were you using?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on July 25, 2019, 06:40:58 AM
J, I was using my Shield 9. I'm thinking hard about going ahead and "pulling the trigger" on a new P365 w/ MS, though. I figure they've been around long enough now to have resolved some of the earlier issues. Smaller, better trigger and sights, more capacity -- very tempting.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on July 25, 2019, 07:37:51 AM
Mine is holding up good with the old striker. All the P365's with a Kanye manual safety (not sure how Kanye got in there) will have all the updates. It's a fine gun.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on July 25, 2019, 12:43:08 PM
I shot 100 rounds about a month ago and realized my shotgunning has negatively affected my pistol shooting.

I was taught to watch the front sight when shooting pistols.

My brain no longer works that way. 

In sporting clays, you always watch the target.  Always, without fail.  If you watch the barrel or the bead, you will miss most of the time.  That is with moving targets, of course, so going back to iron sights and stationary targets with a short sight radius . . .

I hope to put 100 rds through my .45 tonight at 6" plates from 25 yds.  We shall see if watching the target works any better or if I will continue to suck at shooting pistols.

It is highly doubtful there will be any photographic evidence since I'm shooting steel, but we shall see.

Raymond
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on July 26, 2019, 10:11:06 AM
Yep, I continue to suck at pistol shooting.

I used to be able to tap up or down a dueling tree consistently.  Missing was a rare occurrence. 

Now it is the norm.

I may have hit 20% of my targets last night in the first 100 rounds.  HK USP Compact .45 - my favorite pistol.

Dueling Tree before:


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Dueling Tree after 8 shots:

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That is 4 plates moved . . . 50%

Dueling Tree after the next 8 shots:

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Again, 50%

Next 8:

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6 plates moved, so 75%

Next 8:

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2 plates moved . . . 25% - going down hill again . . .

At that point I figured I may as well see if I could hit moving targets since I at least have some experience with them these days, so the Texas Star was configured . . .

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Took me 10 shots to make it look like this:

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So back to 50%

I found that several times my sight picture looked much like what my shotgun sight picture looks like.  I always "float the target" which means my gun shoots high and I can always see it above my barrel.  It's really hard to hit a target you can't see . . .

I would find myself shooting the pistol about 8-12" high because I didn't line up the sights.  Part of it was because I wasn't attempting to do so very often and watching the target, but when I would check the sites, I immediately knew I was high.

Also, in shotgunning, there is not the same level of trigger control as in pistol shooting, so my "slapping the trigger" followed my over from sporting clays with a vengeance.

As one of the other guys on the range stated: "Too damn bad it is such a perishable skill."

Raymond
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on July 26, 2019, 10:57:30 AM
Quote from: rbphoto on July 26, 2019, 10:11:06 AMAs one of the other guys on the range stated: "Too damn bad it is such a perishable skill."


Your range mate is familiar with Jack Reacher.

<<Time - Phrase
01:44:36 Hey, Gunny, you mind if I ask you kind of a personal question?
01:44:40 What, you don't think I can shoot any more?
01:44:43 It is a perishable skill.
01:44:45 Yeah, well,
01:44:47 the sun will be up in an hour.>>>
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on July 26, 2019, 11:36:45 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on July 26, 2019, 10:57:30 AM
Quote from: rbphoto on July 26, 2019, 10:11:06 AMAs one of the other guys on the range stated: "Too damn bad it is such a perishable skill."


Your range mate is familiar with Jack Reacher.

<<Time - Phrase
01:44:36 Hey, Gunny, you mind if I ask you kind of a personal question?
01:44:40 What, you don't think I can shoot any more?
01:44:43 It is a perishable skill.
01:44:45 Yeah, well,
01:44:47 the sun will be up in an hour.>>>

I am familiar with Reacher.

Long before they stuck a midget into the Hollywood-ized version of him for the screen.

I read them all pretty much as soon as they were published.

Raymond
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on July 26, 2019, 12:07:46 PM
Quote from: rbphoto on July 26, 2019, 11:36:45 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on July 26, 2019, 10:57:30 AM
Quote from: rbphoto on July 26, 2019, 10:11:06 AMAs one of the other guys on the range stated: "Too damn bad it is such a perishable skill."


Your range mate is familiar with Jack Reacher.

<<Time - Phrase
01:44:36 Hey, Gunny, you mind if I ask you kind of a personal question?
01:44:40 What, you don't think I can shoot any more?
01:44:43 It is a perishable skill.
01:44:45 Yeah, well,
01:44:47 the sun will be up in an hour.>>>

I am familiar with Reacher.

Long before they stuck a midget into the Hollywood-ized version of him for the screen.

I read them all pretty much as soon as they were published.

Raymond

Great point that many fail to see.  Still baffles me how they made TC appear taller than his first co-star, Rosamund Pike, whom I believe is a few inches taller.  Child's Reacher is 6'5"; got to love Hollywood!  Makes me confident that Doug has a future in porn.   Those folks can make any object appear larger.  Well, that is what I heard.   
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: itieuglyflies on July 26, 2019, 13:39:07 PM
Observations of Phil's target...."Don't mess with Mr. Lucky"
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on August 23, 2019, 10:10:06 AM
https://www.constitution.org/2ll/schol/2amd_grammar.htm (https://www.constitution.org/2ll/schol/2amd_grammar.htm)

Interesting read from a grammatical perspective.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on September 25, 2019, 11:55:25 AM

I had a bug a few years ago for a 10mm, but shook the bug.  Recently the bug for a 10mm 1911 returned.  RBphoto had a 10mm conversation a few years ago.  Almost talked me into getting one then.  Recently learned Rock Island Armory makes a 1911 Commander size in 10mm.  Really perked my interest.  Sold a few things in the gun safe after I found one at a local shop, and it followed me home.  First range session ran 100 rounds of some semi hot stuff and a mag of some close to max loaded buffalo bore.  Fun gun with some kick.  Had 3 fte and the slide kept locking back with rounds still in mag.  Some reading informed me that the Slide Stop needed to be filed down a little because the next round in magazine was hitting the slide stop and locking the magazine open.  Hopefully after a couple hundred rounds I'll feel comfortable with it joining me in the woods.

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Also ignore the 10mm group.  Really was just letting rounds fly to get a feel for it and trouble shoot it.  At least that's my story and I'm sticking with it.

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: hcrum87hc on September 25, 2019, 15:22:08 PM
I'm trying to decide what to pick up for a new woods gun.  I normally just carry my everyday 9mm for any two legged critters, but I've been contemplating picking up a .357 or 10mm for the 4 legged ones.  I was leaning towards a .357 revolver, but the capacity and familiarity of a semi auto in 10mm would certainly be advantageous.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on September 25, 2019, 15:35:22 PM
Quote from: hcrum87hc on September 25, 2019, 15:22:08 PMfamiliarity of a semi auto in 10mm would certainly be advantageous.

This was the big thing for me.  I've been shooting only Semi Autos for a while now when I go to the range.  I recently went to the range and shot my Ruger SP101 .357 mag and it took me a little bit to get reacclimated to it.  Been about a year since I shot it and getting the grip right was an issue as you hold a revolver differently than a semi auto.  Really is what got me reinterested in 10mm again.  I always fell back on the fact that revolvers are more inherently reliable, but I'm going to run this 10mm for a while and see if it changes my opinions. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on September 25, 2019, 18:22:45 PM
Quote from: hcrum87hc on September 25, 2019, 15:22:08 PMI normally just carry my everyday 9mm for any two legged critters, .......

This might make the weeping prophet lament even more.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: hcrum87hc on September 25, 2019, 18:46:58 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on September 25, 2019, 18:22:45 PMThis might make the weeping prophet lament even more.

You're right. I should probably just start toting an AR pistol to be safe.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on September 25, 2019, 19:10:00 PM
I've never tried a 10mm. I'm apprehensive of getting a 1911 pistol due to all the little parts, disassembly/reassembly. It's been over 46 years since I touched one.
This is my woods gun....
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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on September 27, 2019, 06:59:01 AM
For a woods gun, I love my 10mm.

I always have it when I am deer hunting, and ALWAYS when there are hogs around.

I really don't shoot pistols much anymore, but I routinely spend some time with the 10mm to make certain the ammunition I have feeds consistently.

Nice find with the Commander version.  How well does it soak up recoil with those Buffalo Bore loads?  Finding the right spring combination, and putting in a square firing pin stop may make it much more enjoyable.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on September 27, 2019, 08:42:28 AM
Quote from: rbphoto on September 27, 2019, 06:59:01 AMNice find with the Commander version.  How well does it soak up recoil with those Buffalo Bore loads?  Finding the right spring combination, and putting in a square firing pin stop may make it much more enjoyable.

It's not as abusive as I was thinking it would be. Buffalo Bore was some 180 grain rounds traveling at 1,350 fps. Supposed to 768 ft lbs of energy. Hotter than my .357 mag ammo I ran thru my revolver and felt like the 1911 had quicker follow up shots. Thinking the factory recoil spring is 22 lbs. might mess with the mainspring weights though. Also remembered what you said about square FPS and am planning on installing one soon.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on December 29, 2019, 20:49:32 PM
https://nypost.com/2019/12/29/texas-church-shooting-leaves-2-dead/?fbclid=IwAR3OEWVxR1cnVx_KokKN0mtmHV04aR9bTVW-52JbndC-tqqjS7YeWhnpfVA
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on December 29, 2019, 22:48:49 PM
A good guy with a gun takes down a bad guy with a gun and saves a lot of lives

https://nypost.com/2019/12/29/texas-church-shooting-leaves-2-dead/?fbclid=IwAR3OEWVxR1cnVx_KokKN0mtmHV04aR9bTVW-52JbndC-tqqjS7YeWhnpfVA
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: troutrus on January 01, 2020, 16:41:21 PM
So the good guy with gun limited the deaths to three humans. I say we aim higher, like no guns and no deaths.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on January 02, 2020, 07:47:37 AM
Quote from: troutrus on January 01, 2020, 16:41:21 PMSo the good guy with gun limited the deaths to three humans. I say we aim higher, like no guns and no deaths.

A lofty goal. I suggest we concentrate on disarming criminals first.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 02, 2020, 09:17:13 AM
Quote from: troutrus on January 01, 2020, 16:41:21 PMSo the good guy with gun limited the deaths to three humans. I say we aim higher, like no guns and no deaths.

You are conflating two different ideas.  No guns will not create no deaths.  I argue that no guns will create a more violent society.  Guns empower women. They empower the weak.  They protect the ones that need protecting.  A 100 lb single mother has no chance against a full grown man wishing to do her harm.  Just the other month a pregnant wife down in Florida saved her husband's, unborn child, and her own life by stopping two armed men beating her husband by running to her room and grabbing her AR. You will never be able to change a species that has violence engrained into them.  All you will do by removing guns is allow the evil doers an easy way to go about doing their deeds.  One of my favorite analogies is removing guns from law abiding citizens is like the sheep removing their teeth because the wolves' teeth keep killing them.  As much as I'd love to have faith in society, it is foolish to believe violence will go away with the removal of guns.  I'd rather have the ability to protect myself over the faith that other people will do what is right.  Call me cynical, but there are way too many unstable people in this world and I'd rather focus the efforts towards coming up with solutions for them. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: itieuglyflies on January 02, 2020, 09:23:29 AM
Well stated Big J.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: hcrum87hc on January 02, 2020, 10:15:28 AM
Quote from: Big J on January 02, 2020, 09:17:13 AM
Quote from: troutrus on January 01, 2020, 16:41:21 PMSo the good guy with gun limited the deaths to three humans. I say we aim higher, like no guns and no deaths.

You are conflating two different ideas.  No guns will not create no deaths.  I argue that no guns will create a more violent society.  Guns empower women. They empower the weak.  They protect the ones that need protecting.  A 100 lb single mother has no chance against a full grown man wishing to do her harm.  Just the other month a pregnant wife down in Florida saved her husband's, unborn child, and her own life by stopping two armed men beating her husband by running to her room and grabbing her AR. You will never be able to change a species that has violence engrained into them.  All you will do by removing guns is allow the evil doers an easy way to go about doing their deeds.  One of my favorite analogies is removing guns from law abiding citizens is like the sheep removing their teeth because the wolves' teeth keep killing them.  As much as I'd love to have faith in society, it is foolish to believe violence will go away with the removal of guns.  I'd rather have the ability to protect myself over the faith that other people will do what is right.  Call me cynical, but there are way too many unstable people in this world and I'd rather focus the efforts towards coming up with solutions for them. 

Well said.  Evil people are going to do evil things, whether they use guns, explosives, cars, knives, baseball bats, hammers, or even feet and fists.  You can't prevent it, but you can stop it ASAP after it starts.  I want to have the best possible chance to protect myself and others if, God forbid, I'm ever in such a situation. 

Also, there's no such thing as "no guns," in this country. It's not going to happen.  They're too ingrained in our society and too numerous.  That's not a realistic, or desirable (IMO) goal.  Want to know what could have prevented this lunatic from shooting up a church? A working justice system.  Go look up his past crimes and how his charges were plead down and/or dropped. He should have been in jail where he couldn't have hurt anyone. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 02, 2020, 11:28:29 AM
Quote from: Big J on January 02, 2020, 09:17:13 AMYou are conflating two different ideas.  No guns will not create no deaths.  I argue that no guns will create a more violent society.  Guns empower women. They empower the weak.  They protect the ones that need protecting.  A 100 lb single mother has no chance against a full grown man wishing to do her harm.  Just the other month a pregnant wife down in Florida saved her husband's, unborn child, and her own life by stopping two armed men beating her husband by running to her room and grabbing her AR. You will never be able to change a species that has violence engrained into them.  All you will do by removing guns is allow the evil doers an easy way to go about doing their deeds.  One of my favorite analogies is removing guns from law abiding citizens is like the sheep removing their teeth because the wolves' teeth keep killing them.  As much as I'd love to have faith in society, it is foolish to believe violence will go away with the removal of guns.  I'd rather have the ability to protect myself over the faith that other people will do what is right.  Call me cynical, but there are way too many unstable people in this world and I'd rather focus the efforts towards coming up with solutions for them. 

All those verses on empowering women

https://www.theodysseyonline.com/empowering-verses-women

and all those empowering verses for the weak men

https://luke1428.com/13-encouraging-bible-verses-for-men/

Where the heck did we go wrong?  It seems the 8000-12000 gods, worshiped in human history, have failed us. 

If guns empower women and the weak, then they likely empower the bad guys.  I am as weak as they come, but I'll keep searching. 

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 02, 2020, 11:38:27 AM
You are going back to the sheep and wolf analogy Hiner.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 02, 2020, 12:10:59 PM
Quote from: Big J on January 02, 2020, 11:38:27 AMYou are going back to the sheep and wolf analogy Hiner.


No, because the analogy makes no sense – two different species, 1 predator, 1 prey, as mother nature planned.  I am a wolf that pulled his own teeth so I can't bite my fellow wolf.  I am very weak in your eyes. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 02, 2020, 12:41:15 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 02, 2020, 12:10:59 PM
Quote from: Big J on January 02, 2020, 11:38:27 AMYou are going back to the sheep and wolf analogy Hiner.


No, because the analogy makes no sense – two different species, 1 predator, 1 prey, as mother nature planned.  I am a wolf that pulled his own teeth so I can't bite my fellow wolf.  I am very weak in your eyes. 

Bad guy equals predator
Civilian minding own business equals prey

I argue that someone who decides to go out and shoot up a church or school is not the same "species" as me.  I cannot even begin to comprehend what would drive someone to do such an awful act.

Also, even "Mother Nature" gave prey abilities to ward off attacks from predators.

I also want to address the notion of being weak.  I do not equate someone's desire to not carry or own a gun as weak.  I understand that there are a multitude of people who do not want to carry a gun or do not feel responsible enough to carry one or doesn't see it as a necessity.  I do not consider that weak.  In matter of fact the person who feels they are not responsible enough personally to carry or own a gun is strong in my eyes.  Strength comes from knowing your weakness' and making the most out of your abilities.  I believe everyone has a right to firearms, but that doesn't mean everyone should exercise that right.  Where I differ from a lot of American's today is I feel like everyone personally should make that decision for themselves and not have a government make that decision for them. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Onslow on January 03, 2020, 18:55:46 PM
Swords and battle axes > guns

http://youtu.be/EzG5prqrkqg
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on January 09, 2020, 19:55:02 PM
Big J -- I just got into the 1911 game, durn it. Bought a new Colt Wiley Clapp Lightweight Commander 45ACP. Should be arriving in a few days. Oh boy, I hope I can figure out how to field strip it! Forgot long ago. Here's a stock pic until I can post one of mine when it gets here....

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 09, 2020, 20:53:03 PM
Quote from: Phil on January 09, 2020, 19:55:02 PMBig J -- I just got into the 1911 game, durn it. Bought a new Colt Wiley Clapp Lightweight Commander 45ACP. Should be arriving in a few days. Oh boy, I hope I can figure out how to field strip it! Forgot long ago. Here's a stock pic until I can post one of mine when it gets here....

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You picked a mighty fine 1911. Can't go wrong with a Colt. Just avoid the idiot scratch when you put the slide stop pin back in. Biggest thing people forget about 1911's and regret that mark.

Thing I love about Colts is they hold their value really well. Being a Wiley Clapp edition, it will probably be discontinued and go up in value a little even
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on January 10, 2020, 06:41:27 AM
Quote from: Big J on January 09, 2020, 20:53:03 PM
Quote from: Phil on January 09, 2020, 19:55:02 PMBig J -- I just got into the 1911 game, durn it. Bought a new Colt Wiley Clapp Lightweight Commander 45ACP. Should be arriving in a few days. Oh boy, I hope I can figure out how to field strip it! Forgot long ago. Here's a stock pic until I can post one of mine when it gets here....

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Just avoid the idiot scratch when you put the slide stop pin back in. Biggest thing people forget about 1911's and regret that mark.

Google Images: "1911 slide stop idiot mark fix log man"

Easy fix and you will never need another tool to avoid the idiot mark.  Mega simple.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on January 10, 2020, 15:48:30 PM
"Google Images: "1911 slide stop idiot mark fix log man" Easy fix and you will never need another tool to avoid the idiot mark.  Mega simple." -- rbphoto, I'm not gonna start taking a file or Dremel to a brand new gun. Just don't feel comfortable. I'll get one of those Lyman widget slide stop detent tools. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on January 13, 2020, 08:17:31 AM
Quote from: Phil on January 10, 2020, 15:48:30 PM"Google Images: "1911 slide stop idiot mark fix log man" Easy fix and you will never need another tool to avoid the idiot mark.  Mega simple." -- rbphoto, I'm not gonna start taking a file or Dremel to a brand new gun. Just don't feel comfortable. I'll get one of those Lyman widget slide stop detent tools. 

Chicken!

I triangle file and 20 minutes and it'll be good.

A new slide stop is what, $30?

Nearly any good machinist can do this for you in 5 minutes or less.

There's a market out there for slide stops with these pre-cut in them . . .
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on January 13, 2020, 19:41:59 PM
I'm not calling anyone a "nitwit" as my friend who is a true 1911 collector and noted marksman says, but this is a quote of his --

"A 1911 is a very enjoyable gun to own and shoot ... a lot! Messing with them is fraught with more difficulties than leaving them be, unless messing with them is intended to become one's hobby. I have observed perfectly good and reliable 1911s reduced to malfunctioning rubbish by nitwits. This was early in a shooting career and I vowed to avoid doing the same. Leaving 'em alone and just shooting 'em has worked out alright for me."

I'm kind of in this camp. I'm not a born "messer." I plan to learn how to disassemble, clean, and reassemble mine, but will take it to my local gunsmith (also a friend) if it needs much of anything else.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 13, 2020, 20:51:51 PM
Ain't nothing wrong with that and will save you a lot of headache. Haha. Trust me, I know. I'm a tinkerer. Love the mechanics of a firearm. They are simple machines that appeases my tinkering side. I also have gotten very mad at a part that won't go back. Have to just know when to put it down and take a break and try again later. The sear cage in the CZ's have taught me that.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Woolly Bugger on January 14, 2020, 08:28:21 AM
Are you a Republican, a Democrat, or a Southerner? This little test will help you decide:

You're walking down a deserted street with your wife and two small children.

Suddenly, a Terrorist with a huge knife comes around the corner, locks eyes with you, screams obscenities, raises the knife, and charges at you...

You are carrying a Kimber 1911 chambered in .45 ACP, and you are an expert shot. You have mere seconds before he reaches you and your family. What do you do?

******************************
Democrat's Answer:

Well, that's not enough information to answer the question! What is a Kimber 1911 and what does .45 ACP mean?

Does the man look poor or oppressed? Is he really a terrorist? Am I guilty of profiling? Have I ever done anything to him that would inspire him to attack?

Could I possibly swing the gun like a club and knock the knife out of his hand? What does the law say about this situation?

Does the pistol have an appropriate safety built into it? Why am I carrying a loaded gun anyway, and what kind of message does this send to society and to my children?

Is it possible he'd be happy with just killing me? Does he definitely want to kill me, or would he be content just to wound me?

Should I call 9-1-1? Why is this street so deserted? Can we make this a happier, healthier street that would discourage such behavior.

I need to debate this with some friends for a few days and try to come to a consensus. This is all so confusing!

******************************
Republican's Answer:

BANG!

******************************
Southerner's Answer:

BANG!
BANG! BANG!
BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG!
Click.....

(Sounds of reloading)

BANG!
BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG!
BANG!
Click.

Daughter: "Nice grouping, Daddy! Were those the Speer Gold Dots or Federal Premium hollow points?!"

Son: "Can I shoot the next one?!"

Wife: "You are NOT taking that to a Taxidermist!"
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on January 14, 2020, 08:35:07 AM
 :laugh:     
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on January 16, 2020, 08:27:37 AM
New Toy --

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 21, 2020, 09:36:38 AM
Attended VCDL Lobby Day yesterday.  It was a great turnout.  Especially considering all the fearmonging the Governor tried to do to get people to stay home.  He likened it to the Charlotesville White Supremist Rally and stated "imminent threats".  I know a dozen people that fell for his ploy and decided last minute to stay home.  I truly wonder how many people would of been there if this wasn't the case.  That said, the Governor and Media are saying 22,000 people showed.  That is an extremely underinflated number.  The few aerial shots they have (because it was a no fly zone and no drones allowed) and computer programs estimating numbers has the total to be between 50k-60k realistically.  It honestly felt like 100K in the moment.  Every street you were allowed access on around capital square (3 sides) was filled with people.  And then every access street leading in was also filled.  There was no good way to get a clear sense of the multitude of people from the photos because they were dispersed over such a great area due to the state fencing in the capital grounds.  The only racist I saw was the man in blackface or KKK outfit on posters.  Majority was old white men at the rally, but a good showing of black gun community was there and also some pictures circulating of the small showing the LGBT community had.  What amazed me too was the amount of women that realize they are disproportionately affected by 2A restrictions and made a strong showing.  Look at some of the pictures and you will see they had a strong showing.  Last thing to note is this is the most polite crowd I have ever been apart of.  Everyone was bumping into each other trying to walk and it was all "excuse me", "I'm sorry", "you mind if I squeeze by", etc.  They were also thanking police officers for doing their jobs and also thanking the media for covering the event.  The media anchors that were reporting genuine politeness of the event would have a dozen people cheer and thank them after they went off air.  Afterwards citizens were going around and picking up all the trash from the event that fell too the streets.  It was truly something awesome to witness and gives hope to society.  I'd say 30% of the people walking around outside "state of emergency" zone were walking with slung AR's or AK's.  One guy was walking around with a 5ft Barret .50 haha.  Not only did I feel comfortable at this event, I felt extremely protected by everyone exercising their rights.  Not a single firearm related incident took place too.  Crazy considering a bunch of armed white supremist didn't go apocalyptic like the governor and media and legislators that were cowering in safe houses would lead you to believe. 


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If you look in the background you can see the crowd going up the hill.

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My favorite sign.  Dude took a shirtless picture of himself and was proud. 

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Was walking behind this guy trying to make our away against the flow of the crowd. Noticed his backpack was unzipped and about to lose a CD.  When I let him know this, I immediately recognized his voice.  Mrgunsngear from YouTube.  We made some small talk and I thanked him for coming up and supporting this instead of going to SHOT show.  Good genuine guy.

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Came home to some leftover brisket sandwiches with a little bit of hope still left for VA.   V:;
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on January 21, 2020, 10:23:08 AM
Very Good that it was so peaceful and well-attended, Big J. Thumbs up to ya for being there.
"Majority was old white men at the rally..." Heheh. You have such a delicate and respectful way with words....  :laugh:
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 21, 2020, 10:29:34 AM
"Majority was old white men at the rally....."

This tells me all I need to know.

I also feel there is "a little bit of hope still left for VA".  60,000 at the rally.  Even if we assume they were all from Virginia, which ain't true, that is only about 1% of the 5,660,969 Virginia registered voters (if my ciphering is correct).   
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 21, 2020, 10:30:31 AM
Quote from: Phil on January 21, 2020, 10:23:08 AMVery Good that it was so peaceful and well-attended, Big J. Thumbs up to ya for being there.
"Majority was old white men at the rally..." Heheh. You have such a delicate and respectful way with words....  :laugh:

Haha, I'm pro old white men at rallies, but you know the stereotype.  Only old white men support the 2A.  That simply isn't true. 

Also there was an old WWII vet in uniform standing in street with a mega phone a few blocks down all morning speaking to the crowd. He was very very good from what little I heard of him! Wish I could get his name so I knew who it was.  Had a couple hundred people around him listening at all times.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 21, 2020, 10:35:46 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 21, 2020, 10:29:34 AM"Majority was old white men at the rally....."

This tells me all I need to know.

I also feel there is "a little bit of hope still left for VA".  60,000 at the rally.  Even if we assume they were all from Virginia, which ain't true, that is only about 1% of the 5,660,969 Virginia registered voters (if my ciphering is correct).   


You are so full of crap.  How is a gathering of 60K, on a week day that majority of people do not have off, considered a small event in your eyes and insignificant? I promise you Richmond could not handle much more.  Parking garages were closed because of fear of white supremacist, roads were blocked, and off ramps were backed up miles.  It was a logistical nightmare transportation wise.  The city literally made it an awful situation to be apart of and did everything in their power to get people not to come and make it miserable and still tens of thousands came.  AND IN 20 DEGREE WEATHER FOR MOST OF THE MORNING! Was in the low thirties when we left.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 21, 2020, 10:37:03 AM
Enlighten us on how it feels to be in the minority. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 21, 2020, 10:42:08 AM
94% of the state's counties and municipalities are 2A Sanctuaries.  This is not the minority.  No where in the US, in recent times, have we seen such an uprising against a state government.  There are thousands attending BOS meetings all over VA where normally there is only 10's of people attending. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 21, 2020, 10:48:45 AM
And I'll go ahead and explain why that is.  The old saying is "How do you boil a frog? You turn up the heat slowly."  In VA we went from a state that was very 2A friendly to a state that wants to ban and confiscate nearly every semi auto rifle that has a magazine and every shotgun that holds more then 7 shells.  The legislators have seen the error of their ways and are starting to walk back some of the bills or soften them. VA is a safe state.  We average 12 murders from rifles a year (note rifles, no idea if they are all from AR's or bolt actions) and last year there is being reported there was only 8 murders.  While I agree every death is tragic, making half the state felons over night over that many deaths is not a "public health issue" but a control issue.  When you want to get back at me with some facts, feel free too. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on January 21, 2020, 10:52:14 AM
Muddy, are you against the 2nd Amendment? Jist askin'....
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 21, 2020, 10:53:23 AM
Quote from: Big J on January 21, 2020, 10:42:08 AM94% of the state's counties and municipalities are 2A Sanctuaries.  This is not the minority.  No where in the US, in recent times, have we seen such an uprising against a state government.  There are thousands attending BOS meetings all over VA where normally there is only 10's of people attending. 


You are underestimating the silent majority, those that voted in VA's last election.  But, you are correct, very few of that recently mute group attended the sanctuary county board meetings.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 21, 2020, 10:57:05 AM
Quote from: Phil on January 21, 2020, 10:52:14 AMMuddy, are you against the 2nd Amendment? Jist askin'....

No!!!  I own many guns.  In fact, I don't know how many guns I own.  I even have a carry permit.  But, I have never had a fear of the "man" coming and taking my guns.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on January 21, 2020, 11:00:26 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 21, 2020, 10:57:05 AM
Quote from: Phil on January 21, 2020, 10:52:14 AMMuddy, are you against the 2nd Amendment? Jist askin'....

No!!!  I own many guns.  In fact, I don't know how many guns I own.  I even have a carry permit.  But, I have never had a fear of the "man" coming and taking my guns.

Me neither, but the recent VA proposals seem a bit scary and over the top.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 21, 2020, 11:14:49 AM
Quote from: Phil on January 21, 2020, 11:00:26 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 21, 2020, 10:57:05 AM
Quote from: Phil on January 21, 2020, 10:52:14 AMMuddy, are you against the 2nd Amendment? Jist askin'....

No!!!  I own many guns.  In fact, I don't know how many guns I own.  I even have a carry permit.  But, I have never had a fear of the "man" coming and taking my guns.

Me neither, but the recent VA proposals seem a bit scary and over the top.

I agree, some of the proposals are silly, but if you believe the numbers, most Virginians want stricter firearms regulations (whatever that is).  I firmly believe clear heads will prevail, and if not, then this issue will be settled in the courts and at the polling place.  Paranoia on either side will serve no one.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: hcrum87hc on January 21, 2020, 16:27:09 PM
Thanks for showing up J.  If I could have, I'd have made the drive from SC.  Every report I've read mimics yours.  I was very happy with the turnout, and it speaks volumes that there wasn't a single issue of violence or mishandling of guns, considering the vast numbers.  It also gave me hope to see a mix of men and women from all races, backgrounds, creeds, and religions.   

Sadly,  I don't believe the wannabe King Ralph and his ilk will be swayed.  I hope I'm wrong.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Woolly Bugger on January 21, 2020, 16:48:14 PM
best part of the report was the brisket sammy, jis say'in
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 21, 2020, 16:51:53 PM
Quote from: Woolly Bugger on January 21, 2020, 16:48:14 PMbest part of the report was the brisket sammy, jis say'in

But did you see the shirtless man in the poster?  That was juicier than the brisket.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Woolly Bugger on January 21, 2020, 18:29:25 PM
Quote from: Big J on January 21, 2020, 16:51:53 PM
Quote from: Woolly Bugger on January 21, 2020, 16:48:14 PMbest part of the report was the brisket sammy, jis say'in

But did you see the shirtless man in the poster?  That was juicier than the brisket.
To each their own...
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: hcrum87hc on January 22, 2020, 08:28:19 AM
Quote from: Woolly Bugger on January 21, 2020, 16:48:14 PMbest part of the report was the brisket sammy, jis say'in

I mean...it did look pretty dang good.  Brisket sandwiches should be protected under the Constitution for sure.  It'd definitely fall under "the pursuit of happiness" from the Declaration of Independence.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Sedition and Pockets on January 22, 2020, 10:37:45 AM
Quote from: hcrum87hc on January 21, 2020, 16:27:09 PMThanks for showing up J.  If I could have, I'd have made the drive from SC.  Every report I've read mimics yours.  I was very happy with the turnout, and it speaks volumes that there wasn't a single issue of violence or mishandling of guns, considering the vast numbers.  It also gave me hope to see a mix of men and women from all races, backgrounds, creeds, and religions.   

Sadly,  I don't believe the wannabe King Ralph and his ilk will be swayed.  I hope I'm wrong.

The whole march was an act of violence and overt political terrorization, that it didn't break into open physical violence is a testament to the degree that the show of force intimidated the opposition and kept counterprotesters off the streets.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on January 22, 2020, 11:18:43 AM
I'm in the middle on this one, kind of. I'm all for the demonstration in support of the 2nd Amendment if the VA residents feel it is being threatened by proposed gun laws. I think it is stupid and a form of "overt political terrorization"(Dylar's words), however, to carry around long guns like AK's and 50 cal. rifles in public, even if the law allows open carry. Why make the general public feel threatened in the light of all the recent mass shootings? 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 22, 2020, 11:30:37 AM
I understand that point Phil. And in VCDL's defense, they told everyone that if they want to help our cause, leave the long guns at home. Said you can bring them if you want, it's your right, but they would prefer you didn't due to optics to public.

On another note, the acts of violence was solely a label to the event given for political reasons by Northam and media. The organization has been doing this event for over a decade I believe. Not a single incident of violence or white supremacy. Sure, a few bad actors and morons on the internet might of said dumb things, but it's the internet. The track record and narrative being put out by event organizers were not what opposition or media were reporting. It was overhyped politicalization of a rally around the constitution. That is it. There were transgenders there, homosexuals, African Americans, Asians, women, men, old, and young. Obviously the minority groups saw right through the BS and they were welcomed with open arms.  If you don't believe me, look up their testimonies on the event.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: hcrum87hc on January 22, 2020, 13:13:42 PM
Quote from: Dylar on January 22, 2020, 10:37:45 AMThe whole march was an act of violence and overt political terrorization, that it didn't break into open physical violence is a testament to the degree that the show of force intimidated the opposition and kept counterprotesters off the streets.

Such violence.  Much terror.
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The rally was inclusive of anyone and everyone, as long as they didn't want to infringe on the rights of others.  And there were counter protesters there.  Members of the Revolutionary Communist Party are reported to have attended in opposition.  Also, who'd have thought the presence of firearms prevents violence...what a novel idea.


Quote from: Big J on January 22, 2020, 11:30:37 AMThe track record and narrative being put out by event organizers were not what opposition or media were reporting. It was overhyped politicalization of a rally around the constitution. That is it. 

This.  Look at how the media portrayed the event prior and during the rally.  They were hoping something would happen so they could say, "told you so."
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Sedition and Pockets on January 22, 2020, 18:39:44 PM
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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 22, 2020, 18:47:33 PM
Quote from: hcrum87hc on January 22, 2020, 13:13:42 PMThey were hoping something would happen so they could say, "told you so."

Bullshit!  You can't be that tribally, gullibly ignorant!!!  The "told you so" premise does not hold up in my mind.   

Considering what happened in Charlottesville in 2017, I doubt the authorities jumped the gun on its pre-evaluation of this rally. 

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: driver on January 22, 2020, 22:07:45 PM
I see they got a picture of every person that wasn't a white male attending.

Tactical guys are weird. I know several, and it like they always hoping the shit hits the fan one day, because they have researched on YouTube all the tactical ways to kill someone. And hope to use it one day. And will gladly tell you all about it.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Onslow on January 23, 2020, 05:38:09 AM
Quote from: driver on January 22, 2020, 22:07:45 PMTactical guys are weird. I know several, and it like they always hoping the shit hits the fan one day, because they have researched on YouTube all the tactical ways to kill someone. And hope to use it one day. And will gladly tell you all about it.

Such fixations are the norm for ASD folks who are high functioning.  BTW, did you know there were at least 300 commercial varieties of red delicious apples?  I've memorized them all.......

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 23, 2020, 07:17:48 AM
Quote from: driver on January 22, 2020, 22:07:45 PMI see they got a picture of every person that wasn't a white male attending.

Tactical guys are weird. I know several, and it like they always hoping the shit hits the fan one day, because they have researched on YouTube all the tactical ways to kill someone. And hope to use it one day. And will gladly tell you all about it.

They also got pictures of every group carrying slung AR's. Like I said earlier, it was far from the majority. But looking at media pictures you'd think you weren't allowed into Richmond unless you were carrying one.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: hcrum87hc on January 23, 2020, 08:47:36 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 22, 2020, 18:47:33 PM
Quote from: hcrum87hc on January 22, 2020, 13:13:42 PMThey were hoping something would happen so they could say, "told you so."

Bullshit!  You can't be that tribally, gullibly ignorant!!!  The "told you so" premise does not hold up in my mind.   


I may be dumb, but I'm not stupid! 

So you're telling me the liberal, anti-2A MSM wouldn't have eaten it up if something had occurred?  They've been trying to vilify the attendees since days before the event (and gun owners in general for years), and even continued to throughout the day of the event.  I've seen numerous people, including those in the MSM, spouting lies about the event and the people who attended trying to make it out to have been some white nationalist/supremacist rally as opposed to a 2A rally open to anyone, regardless of race, sex, religion, creed, etc. 

Had something happened, those same talking heads would have been snapping at the bit to say, "See, they are violent and the guns have to go.  We were right all along." Instead, you have gun owners saying, "See, we're not violent.  We just want to be left alone."

In regards to those carrying ARs and all kitted out, do I believe that was necessary or the best way to go about it?  No, but it's their right to do so, so I don't begrudge them that, and I definitely don't consider that a mode of violence or terrorism.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 23, 2020, 08:59:52 AM
Quote from: Onslow on January 23, 2020, 05:38:09 AMBTW, did you know there were at least 300 commercial varieties of red delicious apples?  I've memorized them all.......



This has got to be one of the better statements made on BRFFF in a long time.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Woolly Bugger on January 23, 2020, 09:29:43 AM
Y'all gonna like this article

https://www.gq.com/story/pro-gun-rally-threat
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 23, 2020, 09:55:15 AM
https://www.stripes.com/news/us/writer-resigns-from-new-yorker-magazine-after-twitter-flap-over-marine-vet-s-tattoo-1.534340 (https://www.stripes.com/news/us/writer-resigns-from-new-yorker-magazine-after-twitter-flap-over-marine-vet-s-tattoo-1.534340)

She is a highly regarded reporter.....hahaha
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: hcrum87hc on January 23, 2020, 10:31:37 AM
Quote from: Big J on January 23, 2020, 09:55:15 AMhttps://www.stripes.com/news/us/writer-resigns-from-new-yorker-magazine-after-twitter-flap-over-marine-vet-s-tattoo-1.534340 (https://www.stripes.com/news/us/writer-resigns-from-new-yorker-magazine-after-twitter-flap-over-marine-vet-s-tattoo-1.534340)

She is a highly regarded reporter.....hahaha

Looking at her other GQ articles, she's not a reporter at all.  She's an op-ed writer.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 23, 2020, 10:50:48 AM
https://thefederalist.com/2020/01/22/what-i-saw-at-the-richmond-second-amendment-rally/ (https://thefederalist.com/2020/01/22/what-i-saw-at-the-richmond-second-amendment-rally/)

Here is an opinion piece from someone a few of us on here know.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 24, 2020, 07:58:45 AM
Quote from: Big J on January 23, 2020, 10:50:48 AMhttps://thefederalist.com/2020/01/22/what-i-saw-at-the-richmond-second-amendment-rally/ (https://thefederalist.com/2020/01/22/what-i-saw-at-the-richmond-second-amendment-rally/)

Here is an opinion piece from someone a few of us on here know.

"Of note, because I do not suspect this will be reported: A strong number of the folks carrying ARs also had medical or first aid kits on their persons. These were not individuals anticipating offensive action; these individuals were prepared to help."

Sorry Big J, but this analysis seems odd to me.  Please explain.

I don't know Todd from Roanoke, but is this opinion transcript from the retired Presbyterian minister another nugget of religious hypocrisy? 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2015/12/28/im-evangelical-you-cant-be-pro-life-and-pro-gun/
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: hcrum87hc on January 24, 2020, 08:48:35 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 24, 2020, 07:58:45 AMI don't know Todd from Roanoke, but is this opinion transcript from the retired Presbyterian minister another nugget of religious hypocrisy? 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2015/12/28/im-evangelical-you-cant-be-pro-life-and-pro-gun/

You can find numerous opinions from various pastors stating differing views on guns and what the Bible says about self defense and killing vs murder.  In my opinion, it is an act of love to stop a fatal threat if it is to save innocent lives.  The intent and desire in the case of self defense or defense of others is not to kill someone, but to stop them from killing further. 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2015/12/30/an-implausible-argument-that-evangelicals-must-oppose-self-defense/ (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2015/12/30/an-implausible-argument-that-evangelicals-must-oppose-self-defense/)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on January 24, 2020, 09:20:25 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 24, 2020, 07:58:45 AM
Quote from: Big J on January 23, 2020, 10:50:48 AMhttps://thefederalist.com/2020/01/22/what-i-saw-at-the-richmond-second-amendment-rally/ (https://thefederalist.com/2020/01/22/what-i-saw-at-the-richmond-second-amendment-rally/)

Here is an opinion piece from someone a few of us on here know.

"Of note, because I do not suspect this will be reported: A strong number of the folks carrying ARs also had medical or first aid kits on their persons. These were not individuals anticipating offensive action; these individuals were prepared to help."

Sorry Big J, but this analysis seems odd to me.  Please explain.

I don't know Todd from Roanoke, but is this opinion transcript from the retired Presbyterian minister another nugget of religious hypocrisy? 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2015/12/28/im-evangelical-you-cant-be-pro-life-and-pro-gun/

I had a tourniquet on me Monday.  I also carry one in each of the first aid kits in our cars.  I have first aid training like a lot of people that take self defense seriously (even though I need a refresher course). I'm confused at what seems odd to you?  First aid performed quickly is one of the biggest things that can save a life in an emergency situation.  With the exception of a tourniquet, first aid is intended to be performed on another individual.  A lot of individuals believe that if you are carrying a firearm, you ought to take another step and be prepared for aftermath of an encounter.  While I do not normally carry a tourniquet daily, Monday I felt appropriate to with the elevated risk drummed up by the governor as a precaution even if I didn't think anything was going to happen.  I had a great college professor who taught the first aid class and she really emphasized the importance of at least having a tourniquet in each of your vehicles as that is the situation where trauma is most likely to occur.  I have been on top of my wife lately about taking a first aid class with me as we have a 2 yo and 4 yo who have had a couple close calls.  2 pool incidents and one choking incident.  The choking incident did require the Heimlich.  Luckily I was home and remembered the maneuver from 5 years prior for a toddler.  I fail to understand why someone cannot have a firearm for self defense and be prepared to help others medically.  Both to me are the same.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 24, 2020, 09:57:58 AM
Quote from: Big J on January 24, 2020, 09:20:25 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on January 24, 2020, 07:58:45 AM
Quote from: Big J on January 23, 2020, 10:50:48 AMhttps://thefederalist.com/2020/01/22/what-i-saw-at-the-richmond-second-amendment-rally/ (https://thefederalist.com/2020/01/22/what-i-saw-at-the-richmond-second-amendment-rally/)

Here is an opinion piece from someone a few of us on here know.

"Of note, because I do not suspect this will be reported: A strong number of the folks carrying ARs also had medical or first aid kits on their persons. These were not individuals anticipating offensive action; these individuals were prepared to help."

Sorry Big J, but this analysis seems odd to me.  Please explain.

I don't know Todd from Roanoke, but is this opinion transcript from the retired Presbyterian minister another nugget of religious hypocrisy? 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2015/12/28/im-evangelical-you-cant-be-pro-life-and-pro-gun/

I had a tourniquet on me Monday.  I also carry one in each of the first aid kits in our cars.  I have first aid training like a lot of people that take self defense seriously (even though I need a refresher course). I'm confused at what seems odd to you?  First aid performed quickly is one of the biggest things that can save a life in an emergency situation.  With the exception of a tourniquet, first aid is intended to be performed on another individual.  A lot of individuals believe that if you are carrying a firearm, you ought to take another step and be prepared for aftermath of an encounter.  While I do not normally carry a tourniquet daily, Monday I felt appropriate to with the elevated risk drummed up by the governor as a precaution even if I didn't think anything was going to happen.  I had a great college professor who taught the first aid class and she really emphasized the importance of at least having a tourniquet in each of your vehicles as that is the situation where trauma is most likely to occur.  I have been on top of my wife lately about taking a first aid class with me as we have a 2 yo and 4 yo who have had a couple close calls.  2 pool incidents and one choking incident.  The choking incident did require the Heimlich.  Luckily I was home and remembered the maneuver from 5 years prior for a toddler.  I fail to understand why someone cannot have a firearm for self defense and be prepared to help others medically.  Both to me are the same.

Thanks.  It must be me and my skeptical, convoluted, twisted view of all things human.  The dichotomy, to me, is paradoxically confusing in this particular Virginia venue; toting an AR designed for taking life, maiming, protection from other two-legged critters, or even making a political statement while also carrying medical kits to help or save life seems peculiar, unless you're in a deliberate military-type conflict.

I've pissed away enough brain fitness trying to make sense of the mentality on both sides of this issue.  As I've said before, I would not have made a good soldier.

Peace.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on February 12, 2020, 19:51:39 PM
Went and practiced with my Colt LW Commander again today -- first 7 rounds at 20 yards. One flyer, but decent.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on February 17, 2020, 15:47:50 PM
Quote from: Phil on February 12, 2020, 19:51:39 PMWent and practiced with my Colt LW Commander again today -- first 7 rounds at 20 yards. One flyer, but decent.

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Did you like shooting it?  Something about 1911's are just fun to shoot at the range.  Hard to beat a crisp SA 1911 trigger.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on February 17, 2020, 17:47:26 PM
Quoteauthor=Big J

Did you like shooting it?  Something about 1911's are just fun to shoot at the range.  Hard to beat a crisp SA 1911 trigger.

I have about 350 rounds through it so far. I really like it. Accurate, great trigger for sure. Putting it back together after cleaning is a pain, but I'll get used to it. Sure makes my other pistols seem easier to clean/reassemble! heheh. I'm carrying it IWB a lot now instead of my Shield 9.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on March 24, 2020, 09:04:48 AM
Thought I'd mention here that with the current ammo panic buying going on right now with 5.56, .223, and 9mm, that if you want .22 for plinking or hunting buy you some now.  Everything I've been hearing from the gun talks and industry is all the ammo manufacturers are tooling up for the major calibers that have great demand right  now and better profit margins.  Prices are going up with demand for 5.56, .223, and 9mm. The profit margins in .22 lr just aren't great to begin with and it is definitely not profitable in short runs of .22lr so they are switching everything over to other calibers.  I'm expecting .22lr supplies to dry up like they did in 2012.  If you need it, get it now while you can.  With it being an election year, I expect the long term hiatus on .22lr to be a long term event.  I'm all set with all my calibers and I'm just not going to be shooting much (which local range just closed down anyways).  Just a heads up.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: RiverbumCO on March 24, 2020, 18:58:23 PM
Big J, have you ever bought one of the "black boxes" from federal with, I think, 1000 rounds?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on March 24, 2020, 19:21:54 PM
Quote from: RiverbumCO on March 24, 2020, 18:58:23 PMBig J, have you ever bought one of the "black boxes" from federal with, I think, 1000 rounds?

Federal Black Pack is good to go. Bought a pack of 500 9mm back when they were running rebates on them. Say it's on par with Winchester white box. Good for plinking. Sure the .22 would be the same.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: RiverbumCO on March 24, 2020, 19:56:14 PM
I could use a little more 9 but good to go on 22.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Woolly Bugger on March 25, 2020, 21:27:44 PM
From what I've heard Dunham's in Burlington and perhaps Martinsville have .22lr as of today. No purchase limits. As usual call before you go, they may have to close by Friday or Saturday
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on March 26, 2020, 06:51:53 AM
Quote from: RiverbumCO on March 24, 2020, 19:56:14 PMI could use a little more 9 but good to go on 22.

Good luck finding 9mm, .38 special, or .45ACP! None to be found online or elsewhere -- scarce as toilet paper. I have enough of all, but not enough to go range shooting. No live fire practice presently, and rationing the T.P.  :o 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on April 17, 2020, 16:35:33 PM
Fun today -- draw and quick fire from 10, then 15, then 20 yards. 56 rounds total from the Colt LW Commander .45 acp. Pulled the backer and target off and laid it on the table for a picture. Not great shooting, but decent. Made some big holes, anyway....  /'/

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dougfish on April 17, 2020, 18:40:44 PM
I won't be sneaking up on Phil! :o
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on April 20, 2020, 10:17:34 AM
You shooting at an outdoor range Phil or you have some private property? VA shut down all the indoor ranges and I think they shut down their public NF outdoor ranges too.  A few of the outdoor private clubs still have their ranges running but word is nobody is shooting due to saving ammo. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on April 20, 2020, 12:19:24 PM
Quote from: Big J on April 20, 2020, 10:17:34 AMYou shooting at an outdoor range Phil or you have some private property? VA shut down all the indoor ranges and I think they shut down their public NF outdoor ranges too.  A few of the outdoor private clubs still have their ranges running but word is nobody is shooting due to saving ammo. 

J, my gun club is an outdoor range with many bays and areas. I haven't been in several weeks since I too am saving ammo, but have plenty enough to stay in practice.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on April 20, 2020, 13:50:41 PM
Quote from: Phil on April 20, 2020, 12:19:24 PMJ, my gun club is an outdoor range with many bays and areas. I haven't been in several weeks since I too am saving ammo, but have plenty enough to stay in practice.

Last time I was out was March 15th to test out some changes I made to the 10mm 1911.  Also shot a couple hundred rounds out of my CZ P01 and my Suppressed .22

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The Suppressor was a dirty girl.  Took me an hour to get all the baffles out.  Think I had 500ish rounds through it since the last time I cleaned it and it was nearly welded together. A lot of soaking and smacking was involved.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on April 20, 2020, 14:56:40 PM
Looks like you got that RIA and/or the CZ running just fine.  'c;
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Onslow on April 20, 2020, 18:54:49 PM
Quote from: Phil on April 20, 2020, 12:19:24 PM
Quote from: Big J on April 20, 2020, 10:17:34 AMYou shooting at an outdoor range Phil or you have some private property? VA shut down all the indoor ranges and I think they shut down their public NF outdoor ranges too.  A few of the outdoor private clubs still have their ranges running but word is nobody is shooting due to saving ammo. 

J, my gun club is an outdoor range with many bays and areas. I haven't been in several weeks since I too am saving ammo, but have plenty enough to stay in practice.

WGC?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on April 20, 2020, 19:43:21 PM
Quote from: Big J on April 20, 2020, 10:17:34 AMA few of the outdoor private clubs still have their ranges running but word is nobody is shooting due to saving ammo. 

I wonder why some are conserving ammo.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Onslow on April 20, 2020, 19:59:10 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on April 20, 2020, 19:43:21 PM
Quote from: Big J on April 20, 2020, 10:17:34 AMA few of the outdoor private clubs still have their ranges running but word is nobody is shooting due to saving ammo. 

I wonder why some are conserving ammo.

Ammo hoarding is probably a measure of unmitigated anxiety stemming from the feeling of one not being able to affect control during periods of troubling circumstances.

 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on April 21, 2020, 04:05:15 AM
Quote from: Onslow on April 20, 2020, 19:59:10 PMAmmo hoarding is probably a measure of unmitigated anxiety stemming from the feeling of one not being able to affect control during periods of troubling circumstances.



Could be, but why not hoard something that would possibly diminish the anxiety even if it is unmitigated?  Hoard booze, drugs, porn, favorite ice cream, or if you believe in such folly, copies of Claire Weekes or the New Testament?  I don't get it!
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Onslow on April 21, 2020, 05:24:16 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on April 21, 2020, 04:05:15 AM
Quote from: Onslow on April 20, 2020, 19:59:10 PMAmmo hoarding is probably a measure of unmitigated anxiety stemming from the feeling of one not being able to affect control during periods of troubling circumstances.



Could be, but why not hoard something that would possibly diminish the anxiety even if it is unmitigated?  Hoard booze, drugs, porn, favorite ice cream, or if you believe in such folly, copies of Claire Weekes or the New Testament?  I don't get it!

I don't either.  Healthy living that includes sufficient sleep, no personal debt, healthy food intake, no drugs, generally no alcohol, and no adultery has served me well. The last doctor intervention took place 6-7 years ago, and involved a fish hook in my thumb. There are 4 full freezers in the basement, a canning shelf full of food, and a planted garden. The world can go to hell, and I'll likely be ok.  If not, there are a couple bullets in rifle if things become so miserable.

Oh, and big pharma can kiss my ass.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on April 21, 2020, 06:48:43 AM
Onslow -- yes, WGC.

The hoarding ammo issue? I don't -- I'm not hobby shooting for fun as much now because so many others are hoarding, just conserving what I have. No ammo is available in stores or online presently. It's all been snatched up by hoarders, just like toilet paper. Onslow is correct -- I think it's a form of anxiety control for some.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: 68camaro on April 21, 2020, 07:00:48 AM
I used to shoot handguns regularly as hobby, due to past shortages I learned my lesson several years ago and although I have not bought any ammo in 2-3 years I have enough in all calibers I shoot to last many years at average shooting range pace.

And if zombies attack I can easily arm my cul-de-sac.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Onslow on April 21, 2020, 07:07:56 AM
Quote from: Phil on April 21, 2020, 06:48:43 AMOnslow -- yes, WGC.

The hoarding ammo issue? I don't -- I'm not hobby shooting for fun as much now because so many others are hoarding, just conserving what I have. No ammo is available in stores or online presently. It's all been snatched up by hoarders, just like toilet paper. Onslow is correct -- I think it's a form of anxiety control for some.

I've probably heard you shoot.  I've spent much time working on homes in near vicinity.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on April 21, 2020, 07:13:57 AM
Quote from: Onslow on April 21, 2020, 07:07:56 AM
Quote from: Phil on April 21, 2020, 06:48:43 AMOnslow -- yes, WGC.

The hoarding ammo issue? I don't -- I'm not hobby shooting for fun as much now because so many others are hoarding, just conserving what I have. No ammo is available in stores or online presently. It's all been snatched up by hoarders, just like toilet paper. Onslow is correct -- I think it's a form of anxiety control for some.

I've probably heard you shoot.  I've spent much time working on homes in near vicinity.

I haven't bothered to fish the creek that runs through there -- probably some browns in it, though.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Woolly Bugger on June 01, 2020, 17:34:24 PM
This just in —- another big spike in gun sales! Nothing like riots in the streets to cause another splurge of buyers!
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on June 02, 2020, 08:41:17 AM
You think this caused a spike, wait until November 2020.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on June 02, 2020, 15:47:37 PM
Quote from: Woolly Bugger on June 01, 2020, 17:34:24 PMThis just in —- another big spike in gun sales! Nothing like riots in the streets to cause another splurge of buyers!

It would be interesting to learn the demographic responsible for the spike.  Do you think it is the paranoid that already owns multiple firearms or new buyers?
 
I'm going to contribute to the spike in the golfing industry.  Yes, I dabble with golf and need a newer set of clubs.  My present clubs are over 25 years old.  No, I ain't any good at the game.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Woolly Bugger on June 02, 2020, 16:17:40 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on June 02, 2020, 15:47:37 PM
Quote from: Woolly Bugger on June 01, 2020, 17:34:24 PMThis just in —- another big spike in gun sales! Nothing like riots in the streets to cause another splurge of buyers!

It would be interesting to learn the demographic responsible for the spike.  Do you think it is the paranoid that already owns multiple firearms or new buyers?
 
I'm going to contribute to the spike in the golfing industry.  Yes, I dabble with golf and need a newer set of clubs.  My present clubs are over 25 years old.  No, I ain't any good at the game.

My inside source says repeat buyers... adding to the arsenal
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on June 02, 2020, 19:16:06 PM
I think I have all the guns I need but I am definitely buying more ammunition.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on June 02, 2020, 19:16:48 PM
I think I have all the guns I need but I am definitely buying more ammunition.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Onslow on June 02, 2020, 19:29:56 PM
Quote from: Big J on June 02, 2020, 08:41:17 AMYou think this caused a spike, wait until November 2020.

Apparently you spend time with people I don't.  Please fill me in on the latest gossip.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Onslow on June 02, 2020, 19:36:42 PM
If one is overcome with anxiety, why not make a nut mix consisting of walnuts, pecans, cashews, pistachios, and dried blueberries?  This nutrient rich snack will lower your anxiety, and keep one young at heart, literally.

If one makes a trip to the ammo store, I bet there will be a soda, and snack crackers consumed along the way.  This stuff is poison, and the bullets are won't help one's anxiety. Sometimes our most threatening enemy is ourselves.

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on June 02, 2020, 20:41:19 PM
I'm not saying one way or another about it, just historically election years have been high gun sale years. Just look at the Hillary/Trump election. High sales. And Hillary never campaigned hard on gun control. Biden is campaigning pretty hard on gun control. Just predicting November gun sales to pick up and if Biden wins, Dec.- Feb. will be bonkers. I don't need any new toys. Even though I've been eyeballing Dan Wesson 10mm's.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on June 03, 2020, 07:44:47 AM
And here is an article I read earlier that is saying they believe 40% of purchases are first time gun buyers and 40% of those numbers are female. 

https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/retailers-40-of-2020-gun-buyers-are-first-timers-and-40-of-those-are-female/ (https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/retailers-40-of-2020-gun-buyers-are-first-timers-and-40-of-those-are-female/)

People are scared.  People in big cities are seeing that the police are not there to protect you.  People are being dragged out of their vehicles and beaten.  Businesses are burning.  People are starting to realize that it is your own responsibility for you and your families protection. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on June 03, 2020, 08:32:46 AM
Quote from: Big J on June 03, 2020, 07:44:47 AMPeople are scared. 

Correction:  Some people are scared.

And I doubt if "people in big cities" are responsible for the increase in gun sales.  It is likely those folks in the burbs and rural areas.

The best protection for "you and your families" is that mass between your ears.  If that gray matter tells you to purchase a firearm for protection, then do it.  Approximately 2/3 of the remaining U.S. population might take another approach.
   
I'm not sure where gun policies rank on the spectrum of America's concerns/priorities.  My bet is healthcare is number 1, and even that baffles me ---- is it the exorbitant cost that some have to pay, is it the lack of care for ourselves, is it a compassion issue for our fellow humans without care, etc.
 
My number 1 concern is 'the gullibility and blind credulity of the American public'.  This encompasses all issues – guns, healthcare, environment, immigration, politics, worldly affairs, religion, social matters, etc. and the disinformation spewed on social media, traditional media, politicians, the cloud/internet, and all individuals with their heads permanently embedded in their asses.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on June 03, 2020, 08:43:16 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on June 03, 2020, 08:32:46 AM
Quote from: Big J on June 03, 2020, 07:44:47 AMPeople are scared. 

Correction:  Some people are scared.

And I doubt if "people in big cities" are responsible for the increase in gun sales.  It is likely those folks in the burbs and rural areas.

The best protection for "you and your families" is that mass between your ears.  If that gray matter tells you to purchase a firearm for protection, then do it.  Approximately 2/3 of the remaining U.S. population might take another approach.
   
I'm not sure where gun policies rank on the spectrum of America's concerns/priorities.  My bet is healthcare is number 1, and even that baffles me ---- is it the exorbitant cost that some have to pay, is it the lack of care for ourselves, is it a compassion issue for our fellow humans without care, etc.
 
My number 1 concern is 'the gullibility and blind credulity of the American public'.  This encompasses all issues – guns, healthcare, environment, immigration, politics, worldly affairs, religion, social matters, etc. and the disinformation spewed on social media, traditional media, politicians, the cloud/internet, and all individuals with their heads permanently embedded in their asses.

I agree with most of what you said.  I do think from the reports I've been getting that big city gun shops are swamped.  Might be exaggerated because of the low number of gun shops in big cities, but still they have seen a big uptick. 

Using one's noggin these days will save you a lot of grief.  It's an ability that seems to be lacking.  I truly hope that some positives come out of all of this and areas that need reforming get reformed. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on June 03, 2020, 09:08:17 AM
People feel scared and threatened. We're in the middle of three pandemics/crises at once -- epidemiological, economical, and sociological. The world order and national order are basically changing and coming apart simultaneously. Some buy guns to make themselves feel more secure.
<That's simplistic, but all I have time for. Gotta go get groceries and toilet paper now>
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Onslow on June 03, 2020, 17:22:53 PM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on June 03, 2020, 08:32:46 AMI'm not sure where gun policies rank on the spectrum of America's concerns/priorities.  My bet is healthcare is number 1, and even that baffles me ---- is it the exorbitant cost that some have to pay, is it the lack of care for ourselves, is it a compassion issue for our fellow humans without care, etc.
 
My number 1 concern is 'the gullibility and blind credulity of the American public'.  This encompasses all issues – guns, healthcare, environment, immigration, politics, worldly affairs, religion, social matters, etc. and the disinformation spewed on social media, traditional media, politicians, the cloud/internet, and all individuals with their heads permanently embedded in their asses.

The lack of gratitude leads to contempt for all that are of value.  This may be natural resources, our own health, the welfare of others.  The antidote to this problem is hardship, and jolting deprivation.  Human contempt for all things good will result in self inflicted pain, and hardship.

Covid 19 did not get most people's attention. That is what really scares me.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on June 22, 2020, 09:47:58 AM
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New holster coming my way from Bitterroot Gunleather.  Caleb is a great guy and one of the best custom leather holsters right now in the US.  Loooonnnngggggg wait times (This one was 9 months) but soooooo worth it.  Put in an order and put in the notes "brook trout" and was greeted by this picture being sent to me this weekend of the finished product.  This will sport by 10mm 1911 out on the bluelines.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on June 22, 2020, 15:19:01 PM
Purty holster!  :cheers
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on June 23, 2020, 08:12:16 AM
Saturday's practice

Buckmark 22 on 8.5 x 11 from 3 - 25 yds:

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No fliers!

HK 45 USPc on 8.5 x 11 from 3 - 25yds:

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Three serious fliers - one was a double action shot that had two light primer strikes . . . first hiccup on this gun since I bought it.  May be time for some spring updates.

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on June 23, 2020, 08:32:42 AM
Quote from: rbphoto on June 23, 2020, 08:12:16 AMSaturday's practice

Buckmark 22 on 8.5 x 11 from 3 - 25 yds:

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No fliers!

HK 45 USPc on 8.5 x 11 from 3 - 25yds:

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Three serious fliers - one was a double action shot that had two light primer strikes . . . first hiccup on this gun since I bought it.  May be time for some spring updates.



I think the early HK USP's had some known issues with light strikes. Don't know how old yours is, but think they had a firing pin update at some point.  Might look into that before replacing springs.  Also could try some lube.

https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/ftf-on-first-strike-with-hk-usp.146694/ (https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/ftf-on-first-strike-with-hk-usp.146694/)
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on June 23, 2020, 09:46:04 AM
Quote from: Big J on June 23, 2020, 08:32:42 AMI think the early HK USP's had some known issues with light strikes. Don't know how old yours is, but think they had a firing pin update at some point.  Might look into that before replacing springs.  Also could try some lube.

https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/ftf-on-first-strike-with-hk-usp.146694/ (https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/ftf-on-first-strike-with-hk-usp.146694/)

Mine is so old it still has "Pat. Pending" on the grip . . . definitely a first gen.

I cleaned it well and inspected everything.  It was well lubricated and I didn't find any reason for it to have malfunctioned.  It was about 45 rounds into a 50 round session. I've looked at the FP upgrades and I'll probably send it in to Gray Guns for the updates and action work.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Yallerhammer on June 23, 2020, 17:11:38 PM
Quote from: rbphoto on June 23, 2020, 08:12:16 AMSaturday's practice

Buckmark 22 on 8.5 x 11 from 3 - 25 yds:

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No fliers!

HK 45 USPc on 8.5 x 11 from 3 - 25yds:

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Three serious fliers - one was a double action shot that had two light primer strikes . . . first hiccup on this gun since I bought it.  May be time for some spring updates.


Remington ammo?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on June 23, 2020, 19:34:41 PM
Went to two well known sports box stores that sell ammo today and was shocked :o  to see the empty shelves in the Ammo departments.

Maybe not exactly shocked but it is certainly a sign of the times we are living in.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Onslow on June 23, 2020, 19:55:21 PM
Quote from: Big J on June 22, 2020, 09:47:58 AMGuests are not allowed to view images in posts, please Register or Login


New holster coming my way from Bitterroot Gunleather.  Caleb is a great guy and one of the best custom leather holsters right now in the US.  Loooonnnngggggg wait times (This one was 9 months) but soooooo worth it.  Put in an order and put in the notes "brook trout" and was greeted by this picture being sent to me this weekend of the finished product.  This will sport by 10mm 1911 out on the bluelines.

Cracker variant of Bart from Blazing Saddles :P
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on June 24, 2020, 06:05:55 AM
Quote from: Yallerhammer on June 23, 2020, 17:11:38 PMRemington ammo?

In the 22, yes.

In the 45, no.  Atlanta Arms factory reloads.  Never, ever, ever had an issue with them.  There was nothing unusual about the round. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on June 24, 2020, 07:30:32 AM
Quote from: Onslow on June 23, 2020, 19:55:21 PMCracker variant of Bart from Blazing Saddles :P

I have never seen Blazing Saddles so I got to plead ignorance to this reference.

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dougfish on June 24, 2020, 07:50:55 AM
https://youtu.be/-EjWmB45hpY

Full version, recommended:

https://youtu.be/RN9FTMleuxg
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on June 24, 2020, 08:03:38 AM
Classic!  'c;
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on July 29, 2020, 14:46:36 PM
Rare range practice today, limited ammo use due to the shortage. I used a shot timer -- from standing ready, sweep shirt away, draw, 1st shot must be within 2 seconds from the ready position (before the draw). Following shots in less than 1 second each. So - it's aimed fire, but fairly quick. One mag of 7 rounds from my .45 Commander, then two 7-round mags from my Shield 9mm. 2 fliers, but the rest within the 4 or less inch rings. It's a 6" target. Okay at 10 yards, but not stellar. I'm rusty.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on August 01, 2020, 17:43:47 PM
Very nice Phil.  I have been thinking about incorporating a shot timer into my range sessions. I also need to have more range sessions but Corona has really messed that up.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on September 08, 2020, 08:18:47 AM
https://www.npr.org/2020/09/06/910194857/black-gun-ownership-rises-amid-pandemic-protests-for-racial-justice (https://www.npr.org/2020/09/06/910194857/black-gun-ownership-rises-amid-pandemic-protests-for-racial-justice)

Maybe something even Mudwall can get behind.  Big chunk of first time gun buyers going on right now is black females.  Hope as more people get educated on gun ownership and gun buying process, they learn that the majority of gun control on the books are due to racist intentions. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on September 08, 2020, 19:03:08 PM
Quote from: Big J on September 08, 2020, 08:18:47 AMhttps://www.npr.org/2020/09/06/910194857/black-gun-ownership-rises-amid-pandemic-protests-for-racial-justice (https://www.npr.org/2020/09/06/910194857/black-gun-ownership-rises-amid-pandemic-protests-for-racial-justice)

Maybe something even Mudwall can get behind.  Big chunk of first time gun buyers going on right now is black females.  Hope as more people get educated on gun ownership and gun buying process, they learn that the majority of gun control on the books are due to racist intentions. 

What are you trying to say?

Is the gun culture in America a white privilege?  Is packing a gun in public also a freedom of whites?  Were inexpensive firearms banned (gun control I guess) in the south after the Civil War, so poor whites and blacks could not purchase them and threaten the racial hierarchy of the powerful and wealthy?  Did we cry "we need gun control" when the Panthers and Dr. Newton attempted to arm themselves?

Then, on the flip side, we gun-wielding, white Americans try to defend our status by opposing gun control, funding for schools, healthcare for all, etc.

Damn it all; I am confused!!!
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Onslow on September 08, 2020, 19:55:48 PM
Is the ammo shortage legit?  I haven't purchased a box of bullets in over 20 years.

I'm considering purchasing a variety of poleaxes from Ragnarok, both short, and long handled ones. Hopefully LARP won't be taken to the next level come late November.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on September 09, 2020, 07:46:28 AM
Quote from: Onslow on September 08, 2020, 19:55:48 PMIs the ammo shortage legit?  I haven't purchased a box of bullets in over 20 years.

I'm considering purchasing a variety of poleaxes from Ragnarok, both short, and long handled ones. Hopefully LARP won't be taken to the next level come late November.

Is ammo shortage legit? haha.  I haven't seen a box of 9mm in any brand or variety in 4 months at a store.  Online they want $1.25 per round of 9mm when you can find it.  Scary thing is, it is still selling at those ridiculous prices online.  This is easily worse than the 2012-2013 shortages and depending on what happens in November I expect this to continue for a while. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on September 09, 2020, 08:11:09 AM
Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on September 08, 2020, 19:03:08 PMWhat are you trying to say?

Is the gun culture in America a white privilege?  Is packing a gun in public also a freedom of whites?  Were inexpensive firearms banned (gun control I guess) in the south after the Civil War, so poor whites and blacks could not purchase them and threaten the racial hierarchy of the powerful and wealthy?  Did we cry "we need gun control" when the Panthers and Dr. Newton attempted to arm themselves?

Then, on the flip side, we gun-wielding, white Americans try to defend our status by opposing gun control, funding for schools, healthcare for all, etc.

Damn it all; I am confused!!!

Back in the day gun control targeted the African Americans.  If the gun culture today is fighting against gun control wouldn't that make them fighting racism?  Sure you have your NRA fudds who believe the second amendment is about hunting who do not trust a black man walking through Kroger with a gun on his hip. But the majority of the true gun current gun culture is for everyone who is legally able to, and wants to, to have a gun.  I wasn't alive when all the events took place, but I would hope I would of been against all of those scenarios.  The Philando Castile case I was angry about. Just because it is easier, better optics, and more socially acceptable by non gun people for a white person to have a gun, doesn't mean it is condoned by me.  I'm fighting against that.  It is the politicians, media, and ignorance that fuels that, not me, not the majority in the gun culture.  I had a conversation with a non gun person who was feeling uneasy about a black man open carrying in a store.  I said "I have a gun concealed on me right now, if someone saw it at this store on me, would they have any reason to feel uneasy?".  They said "no".  I replied with "they have every right to open carry that gun as I do and I actually commend anyone who open carries". 

Right now you see gun control not targeting African Americans directly, but indirectly.  The political elites are putting taxes, permits, and fees on the right to own guns which pushes people in poverty or lower income out of the ability to own a firearm.  They put annual training requirements which cost money, permits which cost money, taxes on firearms which cost money, and taxes on ammo.  Someone that could maybe purchase a $200 firearm for their family now is looking at double that or more in some states.  All while the elite who are enacting that are unchanged because they are walking around with private security or even publicly funded security.  Oh the hypocrisy.  Guns for me, but not for the peasants.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: troutrus on September 09, 2020, 08:31:52 AM
I recall when there were shortages during Obama admin that there were cries of gun rights being violated.
So, who now is being blamed for shortages?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on September 09, 2020, 09:01:38 AM
Quote from: troutrus on September 09, 2020, 08:31:52 AMI recall when there were shortages during Obama admin that there were cries of gun rights being violated.
So, who now is being blamed for shortages?


More gun control has been passed under Trump in 4 years than 8 years under Obama.  You are barking up the wrong tree.  The bumpstock ban using an executive order with ATF is the most atrocious piece of gun control in the history of gun control.  The President literally changed a definition that was voted on by congress in 1968 with a stroke of a pen.  The precedence this sets is horrifying. 
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: hcrum87hc on September 09, 2020, 11:13:10 AM
Quote from: troutrus on September 09, 2020, 08:31:52 AMI recall when there were shortages during Obama admin that there were cries of gun rights being violated.
So, who now is being blamed for shortages?


Current shortages are due to a run on all things gun related.  This occurs every election year, but it's been made much worse this year due to riots and COVID.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Woolly Bugger on September 10, 2020, 12:21:36 PM
Quote from: Onslow on September 08, 2020, 19:55:48 PMIs the ammo shortage legit?  I haven't purchased a box of bullets in over 20 years.

I'm considering purchasing a variety of poleaxes from Ragnarok, both short, and long handled ones. Hopefully LARP won't be taken to the next level come late November.

My sources say that it is flying off the shelves... 9mm especially is "ripped" from the hands of the associates restocking the shelves when a shipment comes in...

and while their store has no limits on purchases, they ask the customers to be considerate of others, as they continue to empty the shelves and purchase as much as they can... ammo sales are 300% above last year...
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Woolly Bugger on November 17, 2020, 09:07:55 AM
Note from the gun counter: Sales after the election have been off the charts, 30-40 handguns per day, up 300% above last year.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on November 17, 2020, 09:52:58 AM
Since I haven't been fishing lately (planning to fix that Thanksgiving weekend), here are some sighting in pics:

.17HMR bolt action - started low & left.  Quick adjustments got it a hair low at 75yds.  Good enough for coyotes.

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.308 Ruger Hawkeye - started way high, slowly worked it down and got tired of micro adjustments.  Shot 6 is just a hair low at 75yds.  I never shoot it at anything longer and rarely even that long.  Forgot how crisp the factory trigger is on this one.  Not getting a Timney for it anytime soon.  Maybe a new stock. 

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.30-06 Rem 700 - love this gun, but it is just not as accurate as it used to be.  May be time for a new barrel.  After being about 3' off to the right last week, I bore-sighted it and got it about 6" left of center that day.  Adjusted it too far right and finally settled in to where I know I will kill whatever I shoot at with it.  Still at 75yds, when it used to group tighter at 200 . . .

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on November 17, 2020, 10:26:28 AM
Quote from: Woolly Bugger on November 17, 2020, 09:07:55 AMNote from the gun counter: Sales after the election have been off the charts, 30-40 handguns per day, up 300% above last year.

The most interesting fact in your statement is the indication that you might have a relationship with people that work a gun counter or at least visit the gun counter semi regularly.

And kiss ammo goodbye until indefinitely at this time.  Vista Outdoors just said they are backlogged 1 year and $1 Billion on contracts.

https://www.foxbusiness.com/lifestyle/vista-outdoors-ammunition-backlog-billion (https://www.foxbusiness.com/lifestyle/vista-outdoors-ammunition-backlog-billion)

Manufactures are just pumping out 9mm and .223 right now and can't even keep the supply chain steadily stocked, even with a lot of ammo being priced at $1 a round!  I've never seen anything like this, even comparing it to 2012 and 2013.

Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Onslow on November 17, 2020, 10:47:56 AM
Quote from: Big J on November 17, 2020, 10:26:28 AM
Quote from: Woolly Bugger on November 17, 2020, 09:07:55 AMNote from the gun counter: Sales after the election have been off the charts, 30-40 handguns per day, up 300% above last year.



The most interesting fact in your statement is the indication that you might have a relationship with people that work a gun counter or at least visit the gun counter semi regularly.

And kiss ammo goodbye until indefinitely at this time.  Vista Outdoors just said they are backlogged 1 year and $1 Billion on contracts.

https://www.foxbusiness.com/lifestyle/vista-outdoors-ammunition-backlog-billion (https://www.foxbusiness.com/lifestyle/vista-outdoors-ammunition-backlog-billion)

Manufactures are just pumping out 9mm and .223 right now and can't even keep the supply chain steadily stocked, even with a lot of ammo being priced at $1 a round!  I've never seen anything like this, even comparing it to 2012 and 2013.



I'm a cheap bastard, and would rather die then spend money on ammo.  Good will, and manners cost nothing, but add value. I'm not good at the latter, but it is certainly worth any effort.

People need to accept reality, take a deep breath, and quit behaving like a bunch of infantile, entitled peckerheads. Trump lost the election, go with what's between your legs, Covid 19 is real, and does not care how important you feel. Screaming at a nurse will not spare you from Covid, and hording ammo won't either. Pseudo social justice warriors will figh imagined emenies that do not exist, until they destroy themselves.



Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Woolly Bugger on November 17, 2020, 11:03:11 AM
Quote from: Big J on November 17, 2020, 10:26:28 AM
Quote from: Woolly Bugger on November 17, 2020, 09:07:55 AMNote from the gun counter: Sales after the election have been off the charts, 30-40 handguns per day, up 300% above last year.

The most interesting fact in your statement is the indication that you might have a relationship with people that work a gun counter or at least visit the gun counter semi regularly.

And kiss ammo goodbye until indefinitely at this time.  Vista Outdoors just said they are backlogged 1 year and $1 Billion on contracts.

https://www.foxbusiness.com/lifestyle/vista-outdoors-ammunition-backlog-billion (https://www.foxbusiness.com/lifestyle/vista-outdoors-ammunition-backlog-billion)

Manufactures are just pumping out 9mm and .223 right now and can't even keep the supply chain steadily stocked, even with a lot of ammo being priced at $1 a round!  I've never seen anything like this, even comparing it to 2012 and 2013.



I should have also mentioned that there are a good percentage of first time buyers...
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mr. Don on November 17, 2020, 12:44:25 PM
Reloading is an excellent hobby. No shortage here.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: driver on November 17, 2020, 20:17:41 PM
Good thing my ammo of choice is bird shot.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mr. Don on November 17, 2020, 20:36:12 PM
This was my grandfathers. Finest .22 I ever fired.
High Standard Sport King.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mr. Don on November 17, 2020, 20:45:44 PM
Couple of 9mm. Ruger American and Walther PPQ

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mr. Don on November 17, 2020, 21:05:03 PM
GP100 .357 magnum

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mr. Don on November 17, 2020, 21:11:50 PM
40's vintage .30 carbine.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Dougfish on November 17, 2020, 21:33:30 PM
OK.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on November 18, 2020, 04:57:37 AM
Quote from: Woolly Bugger on November 17, 2020, 09:07:55 AMNote from the gun counter: Sales after the election have been off the charts, 30-40 handguns per day, up 300% above last year.

Perhaps this is nothing more than another murmuration of the misguided credulous, the injudicious gullible, the paranoid.  Like the starlings, new members are joining the flock of the misguided cult, moving synchronously through the skies of suspicion.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mr. Don on November 18, 2020, 07:41:31 AM
I came south looking for fly ideas and like an excited puppy I pissed all over the floor. Sorry. I just like guns.  p;-
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on November 18, 2020, 08:23:05 AM
Quote from: Mr. Don on November 17, 2020, 21:11:50 PM40's vintage .30 carbine.

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This M1 Carbine is a sweet gun! The .30 Carbine cartridge gets a lot of crap, but I always thought it was a decent inbetween cartridge between pistol and rifle cartridges.  Heard stories of guys wanting and getting issued these in Vietnam over the M14 because the M14's were a pita to carry around.  @Al might be able to speak some on that.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mr. Don on November 18, 2020, 10:23:04 AM
110 grain ball ammo.

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Quote from: Big J on November 18, 2020, 08:23:05 AM
Quote from: Mr. Don on November 17, 2020, 21:11:50 PM40's vintage .30 carbine.

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This M1 Carbine is a sweet gun! The .30 Carbine cartridge gets a lot of crap, but I always thought it was a decent inbetween cartridge between pistol and rifle cartridges.  Heard stories of guys wanting and getting issued these in Vietnam over the M14 because the M14's were a pita to carry around.  @Al might be able to speak some on that.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: troutrus on November 18, 2020, 12:36:47 PM
I've been looking to upgrade. This thing is a killer on common houseflies, but wasps and the like just laugh at me when they see me coming.
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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on November 18, 2020, 13:32:12 PM
Load it with some coarse kosher salt  V:;
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: hcrum87hc on November 19, 2020, 08:27:50 AM
Quote from: troutrus on November 18, 2020, 12:36:47 PMI've been looking to upgrade. This thing is a killer on common houseflies, but wasps and the like just laugh at me when they see me coming.
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Do those really work well?  I've always been intrigued by them.  I think I'd leave the back door open just to let flies in for target practice.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: hcrum87hc on November 19, 2020, 08:30:38 AM
Quote from: Mr. Don on November 17, 2020, 20:45:44 PMCouple of 9mm. Ruger American and Walther PPQ

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I love my PPQs.  I traded the M1 towards the newer M2.  I sure did love that trigger guard magazine release, but I found myself trying to release the mags on other guns by pushing on the trigger guard, so decided to standardize.  I'd love to pick up one of the new steel frame versions, but they're $$$$$.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: troutrus on November 19, 2020, 09:42:03 AM
Quote from: hcrum87hc on November 19, 2020, 08:27:50 AM
Quote from: troutrus on November 18, 2020, 12:36:47 PMI've been looking to upgrade. This thing is a killer on common houseflies, but wasps and the like just laugh at me when they see me coming.
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Do those really work well?  I've always been intrigued by them.  I think I'd leave the back door open just to let flies in for target practice.
More of a novelty item or gag gift. It will obliterate a fly at 6", but beyond that it merely chases them.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Yallerhammer on November 25, 2020, 09:29:16 AM
My old beat up vintage tang-safety Ruger M77 in .300 Winmag still shoots true.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Al on November 25, 2020, 18:04:03 PM
Quote from: Mr. Don on November 18, 2020, 10:23:04 AM110 grain ball ammo.

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Quote from: Big J on November 18, 2020, 08:23:05 AM
Quote from: Mr. Don on November 17, 2020, 21:11:50 PM40's vintage .30 carbine.

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This M1 Carbine is a sweet gun! The .30 Carbine cartridge gets a lot of crap, but I always thought it was a decent in between cartridge between pistol and rifle cartridges.  Heard stories of guys wanting and getting issued these in Vietnam over the M14 because the M14's were a pita to carry around.  @Al might be able to speak some on that.

Sorry I haven't posted much lately. Been up to my ass in alligators helping manage the Caldwell Wounded Warrior Deer Hunt - got that behind be so will weigh in on the M1 & M2 30 caliber carbine.

When I was enlisted and had not yet gone to war I loved it because it was light and maneuverable. Back then it was either that, a nine pound M1 Gurand or the 12-15 pound BAR. When I first got to Vietnam our indigenous Vietnamese troops also preferred it for the same reasons - using a FMJ bullet it was not much of a man-stopper. Probably a modern bullet would have resolved that but anything but FMJ ball would be considered a war crime. It also did not have very good range. I was down in the Delta where you could see and shoot a long ways so "range" was a factor.

About half way through my first tour (a full year back then - no "deployments" of few weeks or few months like today where a high number of "deployments" no matter where, gives you status), we swapped out the carbines and M1 rifles for the M16. Once again the troops loved them until we got pinned down out in the open but could not reach back to the VC/NVA who were firing from behind a distant paddy dike. After extracting ourselves from a couple of those situations we reissued two BAR per squad. Problem solved.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on November 25, 2020, 19:14:09 PM
My grandfather's .30-40 Springfield Krag he used in the Spanish-American War. Handed down to my father, who handed it down to me.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on November 25, 2020, 19:53:23 PM
Quote from: Al on November 25, 2020, 18:04:03 PMSorry I haven't posted much lately. Been up to my ass in alligators helping manage the Caldwell Wounded Warrior Deer Hunt - got that behind be so will weigh in on the M1 & M2 30 caliber carbine.

When I was enlisted and had not yet gone to war I loved it because it light and maneuverable. Back then it was either that, a nine pound M1 Gurand or the 12-15 pound BAR. When I first got to Vietnam our indigenous Vietnamese troops also preferred it for the same reasons - using a FMJ bullet it was not much of a man-stopper. Probably a Gorden bullet would have resolved that but anything but FMJ ball would be considered a war crime. It also did not have very good range. I was down in the Delta where you could see and shoot a long ways so "range" was a factor.

About half way through my first tour (a full year back then - no "deployments" of few weeks or few months like today where a high number of deployments no matter where gives you status), we swapped out the carbines and M1 rifles for the M16. Once again the troops loved them until we got pinned down out in the open but could not reach back to the VC/NVA who were firing from behind a distant paddy dike. After extracting ourselves from a couple of those situations we reissued two BAR per squad. Problem solved.

Makes sense. Everyone likes a light gun until they want to reach out and touch something. That's why the M14 was the shortest standard issue gun in Military history but they still hang around with units and get issued out sporadically. .308 will reach a little further than .223
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on December 26, 2020, 17:24:57 PM
Safety Rule.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on February 24, 2021, 08:53:51 AM
I recently was able to purchase 400+ rounds of 10mm at a cost equivalent to what I have historically paid for ammunition.

I could probably make $500 on this purchase and never blink, but I actually prefer to shoot my ammunition.

Still can't get enough 12 gauge target ammunition.  People are selling boxes of 25 shells for $14-20/box.  They should be $6.50-$8

Ridiculousness.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: hcrum87hc on February 25, 2021, 09:38:18 AM
Quote from: rbphoto on February 24, 2021, 08:53:51 AMI recently was able to purchase 400+ rounds of 10mm at a cost equivalent to what I have historically paid for ammunition.

I could probably make $500 on this purchase and never blink, but I actually prefer to shoot my ammunition.

Still can't get enough 12 gauge target ammunition.  People are selling boxes of 25 shells for $14-20/box.  They should be $6.50-$8

Ridiculousness.

Yeah, it's nuts.  Unfortunately, I don't see it getting better for a long time.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Woolly Bugger on February 25, 2021, 09:50:08 AM
Quote from: rbphoto on February 24, 2021, 08:53:51 AMI recently was able to purchase 400+ rounds of 10mm at a cost equivalent to what I have historically paid for ammunition.

I could probably make $500 on this purchase and never blink, but I actually prefer to shoot my ammunition.

Still can't get enough 12 gauge target ammunition.  People are selling boxes of 25 shells for $14-20/box.  They should be $6.50-$8

Ridiculousness.

reports from the ammo store is that peeps are making rounds to snap up whatever comes in for resale purposes...

they can't keep ammo in stock ... too many people with too much time on their hands
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on February 25, 2021, 10:02:47 AM
The only two calibers I was able to find the last few months were .17HMR and 350 Legend.  I happen to own both of those and was happy to walk out of the store with my limit, provided prices were not ridiculous.

I now have enough of both to last a very long time.

Finding 12 gauge shotshells is my current mission.

Without breaking the bank.

I shoot 3-500/month for training & competition and can't find enough.
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on February 25, 2021, 10:14:08 AM
Quote from: rbphoto on February 25, 2021, 10:02:47 AMThe only two calibers I was able to find the last few months were .17HMR and 350 Legend.  I happen to own both of those and was happy to walk out of the store with my limit, provided prices were not ridiculous.

I now have enough of both to last a very long time.

Finding 12 gauge shotshells is my current mission.

Without breaking the bank.

I shoot 3-500/month for training & competition and can't find enough.

How do you like the 350 legend? Seems like a decent round but only fixing a specific necessity. It's a good straight walled hunting rounding for states where straight walled cartridges are necessary. How is the accuracy out of that cartridge?
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: rbphoto on February 25, 2021, 11:01:23 AM
It's an AR platform with less recoil than a .223/5.56  I have not sighted it in yet as I'm waiting on a couple more pieces/parts to finish my build.

It will be one I shoot for the rest of my life.  I have bolts actions in both .308 & a .30-06 if I really want to reach out beyond 200yds (something I've never done for a deer).

If I ever want to go sub-sonic (doubtful), there are ammunition options available in 350 Legend.


Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on February 25, 2021, 11:06:02 AM
Today is a range day for me. Heading out shortly. It's getting to be a rather expensive hobby -- even shooting a fraction of the ammo I use to go through.  :o
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Big J on February 25, 2021, 11:39:04 AM
Quote from: Phil on February 25, 2021, 11:06:02 AMToday is a range day for me. Heading out shortly. It's getting to be a rather expensive hobby -- even shooting a fraction of the ammo I use to go through. 

I've been maybe 4 times since March 2020. Half of it was due to the ranges being closed until mid summer and then the ammo shortage hit. I went one time and ran thru a couple hundred rounds of 10mm and 9mm and felt like I was flexin some financial wealth at the range.

And RB let me know how the 350 legend groups.  Not that it's a difference most shooters will experience, but probably get longer barrel life out of the 350 compared to .223/5.55
Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mr. Don on February 25, 2021, 13:26:12 PM
wadcutters

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Mr. Don on February 25, 2021, 13:34:03 PM
Not gonna lie. Took me about a month of working this set up to get where the G21 would come out smoothly. Like buttah now.
Bianchi 82 paddlelock holster.

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Title: Re: For the love of guns
Post by: Phil on February 25, 2021, 15:46:51 PM
Boy, times have changed. Range day today only consisted of 24 rounds .380 (one handed from pocket draw), 28 rounds 9mm, 28 rounds .45 acp, all from varying distances. Trying to hold on to the ammo I already have since I'm not willing to pay $1-2/round!