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waterbugs?

Started by joe friday, May 10, 2016, 11:31:29 AM

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joe friday


forgive me if this is a dumb question, but does anyone know enough about trout to tell me why don't they hit the waterbugs floating across the surface of the water?
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Michael Toris

Quote from: joefriday on May 10, 2016, 11:31:29 AM

forgive me if this is a dumb question, but does anyone know enough about trout to tell me why don't they hit the waterbugs floating across the surface of the water?

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Too hard to catch IMO. These guys make a living on top of the water where Mayflies, Caddisflies, Stoneflies, Midges, etc are eaten when they are most vulnerable (swimming to top of water, emerging on surface, or resting on water. They do not skate like the Hemipterans


Grannyknot

water striders are some fast mofos.

Flea is not the best bassist of all time.

Mudwall Gatewood 3.0

They taste bad - probably nothing to do with speed.   I have seen them in the gut contents of young-of-the-year smallmouth bass, but never in larger fishes.

"Fish do not appear to be the main predators of water striders, but will eat them in cases of starvation. Scent gland secretions from the thorax are responsible for repelling fish from eating them."

http://broom02.revolvy.com/main/index.php?s=Gerridae&item_type=topic

"Enjoy every sandwich."  Warren Zevon

Michael Toris

Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on May 10, 2016, 12:02:42 PM

They taste bad - probably nothing to do with speed.   I have seen them in the gut contents of young-of-the-year smallmouth bass, but never in larger fishes.

"Fish do not appear to be the main predators of water striders, but will eat them in cases of starvation. Scent gland secretions from the thorax are responsible for repelling fish from eating them."

http://broom02.revolvy.com/main/index.php?s=Gerridae&item_type=topic

I don't buy it. Plenty of other things are not edible and end up in the stomach contents (ie cigarette butts, sticks, seeds)


Dougfish

Becha they'd hit a pink strider.

"Why don't you knock it off with them negative waves? Why don't you dig how beautiful it is out here? Why don't you say something righteous and hopeful for a change? " -Oddball, 1970

"I don't wanna go to hell,
But if I do,
It'll be 'cause of you..."
Strange Desire, The Black Keys, 2006

Michael Toris

Quote from: Dougfish on May 10, 2016, 12:34:27 PM

Becha they'd hit a pink strider.

Hell yeah they would

Trout are dumb as fuck

Those bitches are just too hard to catch or they'd eat the shit out of em


Mudwall Gatewood 3.0

Quote from: wildmttrout on May 10, 2016, 12:31:00 PM

I don't buy it. Plenty of other things are not edible and end up in the stomach contents (ie cigarette butts, sticks, seeds)

You're kidding, right?

It is the same with Whirligig Beetle adults.

"Fish apparently learn to reject whirligigs on sight after eating Gyrinidae that are secreting gyrinidal."

http://www.cfb.unh.edu/StreamKey/html/organisms/OColeoptera/FAco_adult/FAGyrinidae/Gyrinidae.html

"Enjoy every sandwich."  Warren Zevon

Michael Toris

Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on May 10, 2016, 12:41:43 PM

Quote from: wildmttrout on May 10, 2016, 12:31:00 PM

I don't buy it. Plenty of other things are not edible and end up in the stomach contents (ie cigarette butts, sticks, seeds)

You're kidding, right?

It is the same with Whirligig Beetle adults.

"Fish apparently learn to reject whirligigs on sight after eating Gyrinidae that are secreting gyrinidal."

http://www.cfb.unh.edu/StreamKey/html/organisms/OColeoptera/FAco_adult/FAGyrinidae/Gyrinidae.html

Birds eat them

Why wouldn't fish?

I realize you have sources and I do not, but I just do not see a fish turning down a meal b/c 'it tastes bad'. They are opportunistic feeders.

But, I have never spotted a fish attempting to feed on them either. So whatever it is, it must be more than they cannot catch them.

I am just not sure.....


Mudwall Gatewood 3.0

Quote from: wildmttrout on May 10, 2016, 12:44:57 PM

Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on May 10, 2016, 12:41:43 PM

Quote from: wildmttrout on May 10, 2016, 12:31:00 PM

I don't buy it. Plenty of other things are not edible and end up in the stomach contents (ie cigarette butts, sticks, seeds)

You're kidding, right?

It is the same with Whirligig Beetle adults.

"Fish apparently learn to reject whirligigs on sight after eating Gyrinidae that are secreting gyrinidal."

http://www.cfb.unh.edu/StreamKey/html/organisms/OColeoptera/FAco_adult/FAGyrinidae/Gyrinidae.html

Birds eat them

Why wouldn't fish?

I realize you have sources and I do not, but I just do not see a fish turning down a meal b/c 'it tastes bad'. They are opportunistic feeders.

But, I have never spotted a fish attempting to feed on them either. So whatever it is, it must be more than they cannot catch them.

I am just not sure.....

Repellency is common in many insects – all kind of true bugs, certain swallowtails, Monarchs, some beetles and ants have such a bad taste or smell,  it discourages potential predators.  I know very little about plants, but I think many plants "taste" bad as well.

I contacted EKU. I convinced them to refund your tuition, room and board, and the fees for all text books and supplies.
You can thank me later.

"Enjoy every sandwich."  Warren Zevon

Michael Toris

Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on May 10, 2016, 13:03:41 PM

Quote from: wildmttrout on May 10, 2016, 12:44:57 PM

Quote from: Mudwall Gatewood 3.0 on May 10, 2016, 12:41:43 PM

Quote from: wildmttrout on May 10, 2016, 12:31:00 PM

I don't buy it. Plenty of other things are not edible and end up in the stomach contents (ie cigarette butts, sticks, seeds)

You're kidding, right?

It is the same with Whirligig Beetle adults.

"Fish apparently learn to reject whirligigs on sight after eating Gyrinidae that are secreting gyrinidal."

http://www.cfb.unh.edu/StreamKey/html/organisms/OColeoptera/FAco_adult/FAGyrinidae/Gyrinidae.html

Birds eat them

Why wouldn't fish?

I realize you have sources and I do not, but I just do not see a fish turning down a meal b/c 'it tastes bad'. They are opportunistic feeders.

But, I have never spotted a fish attempting to feed on them either. So whatever it is, it must be more than they cannot catch them.

I am just not sure.....

Repellency is common in many insects – all kind of true bugs, certain swallowtails, Monarchs, some beetles and ants have such a bad taste or smell,  it discourages potential predators.  I know very little about plants, but I think many plants "taste" bad as well.

I contacted EKU. I convinced them to refund your tuition, room and board, and the fees for all text books and supplies.
You can thank me later.

Meh, I've moved on from silly little bugs. These questions simply are not interesting to me anymore and do not deserve my research time. I'll take your word for it, but in the end, it really doesn't make a great deal to me. It's a bug that doesn't get eaten. Doesn't really matter why.

Whether you like it or not, big data is the way of the future and eDNA is the vector to get there. My days of big pickups are over I am afraid; more numbers for me and less bugs.

What's funny is I never once was asked this question throughout my entire academic career.


Big J

Here is my question, how did the water striders develop the trait of tasting bad?  Natural selection over millions of years allow the bad tasting water striders from poor hygiene to survive while the good tasting water striders diminished?


Michael Toris

Quote from: Big J on May 10, 2016, 13:19:51 PM

Here is my question, how did the water striders develop the trait of tasting bad?  Natural selection over millions of years allow the bad tasting water striders from poor hygiene to survive while the good tasting water striders diminished?

Better questions:

"Why are Water Striders found where they are and what do they actually mean?"

"Can we detect water strider DNA from water samples?"

"Why is Muddy such a hipster but will not acknowledge it?"


Mudwall Gatewood 3.0

Quote from: wildmttrout on May 10, 2016, 13:09:50 PM

What's funny is I never once was asked this question throughout my entire academic career.

Oddest question I was ever asked during my academic career was how often and specifically how did I masturbate.  I answered the face-to-face survey honestly, only to have the young student researcher run away.  To this day, I don't know if was fear, queasiness, suspicion, or the desire to try my methods that sent the young'un scurrying off like an Olympic sprinter.

The next time you see and catch a Whirligig Beetle, squeeze it until the body juices squirt out its ass, then smell it.  Depending on your olfactics, it will likely smell like apples or pineapple.

http://news.discovery.com/animals/bad.htm

Interesting article ---
--- makes me believe if Big J and I are fishing together and one of 5X's or OB's mountain lions stalk us, attempting to get a meal, I will be safe.  My marinating of nicotine and alcohol next to Jacob's clean, pure form will save me.  Any predator will know immediately from the smell that I would taste like garbage.

"Enjoy every sandwich."  Warren Zevon

Big J

I thought Mountain Lions targeted the young, frail, slow, or injured?

WMT's last question made me laugh.



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